HOMEBREW Digest #1184 Mon 19 July 1993

Digest #1183 Digest #1185

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Plastin, Hotbreak (Jack Schmidling)
  Re: dextrose ("Donald G. Scheidt")
  Hello? Anyone Home? (Gene Zimmerman)
  possessed keg and 1.018 is the number of the FG (Bart Thielges)
  international brew transport? (Michael P. O'Neill)
  re: more on sugar in beer ("William A Kitch")
  re: Parking in Portland (Paul dArmond)
  The last bottle (Tim Anderson)
  Hop harvest and Chico yeast (Tom Rush)
  Smells like crap! (CMACK)
  Many Topics... (STBLEZA)
  Carboys (Rich Ryan)
  kegging info - Help! (Jim Sims)
  Use of sucrose solutions in long-term yeast storage (Human Genome Center, LBL) <stevko at genome.lbl.gov>
  Brewers Warehouse propane stove (Tom Altenbach Room 2039)
  Nitrogen and Carbon Dioxide Regulators. (SMUCKER)
  Neuweiler's Stock Ale (kstiles)
  yet another question - alternative brew vessels (Jim Sims)
  RE: Mint Beer (Kristof_Mueller)
  Mint in beer ("Westemeier*, Ed")
  step infusions ("Anton Verhulst")
  Hops for Lambic ("William A Kitch")
  Reno BrewPubs, homebrew clubs, etc? (Chuck Coronella)
  Irish Moss (Rick Garvin (703-761-6630))
  Re: Purchasing Supplies (Fritz Keinert)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 14:21 CDT From: arf at genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling) Subject: Plastin, Hotbreak >From: "/platinum/homes/hethmon/.signature" <hethmon at cs.utk.edu> >Subject: Plastic Fermenters Oh Boy! This is my favorite topic. >I noticed a definite lack of bubbles coming up through the fermentation lock. I asked at my homebrew store and he said it was hard to make a good seal between the lid and pail. It is difficult to get an airtight seal but the necissity to do so is the great issue here. It seals well enough to keep anything from falling in and few things are capable of crawling up, under and into the fermenter via the tiny leaks. Furthermore, during fermentation, CO2 is trying very hard to get out through these leaks and tends to keep other stuff from getting in. The hole in the lid is simply an evil plot by the retailers to force you to buy a fermentation lock to fill the hole. There is enough CO2 generation initially to make it look cool but when the pressure drops off, it looks like fermentation is done but the gas is just leaking out the easy way. I have been fermenting for several years in a SS kettle with a lid that just rests on and makes no attempt at an airtight fit and see no need to worry about the fit of the lid on the plastic fermenter. The idea of using a carboy and blow-off system still gives me a headache. It seems to be another one of those solutions to a problem that does not exist. That is not to say that after primary fermentation is complete, that is should not be transferred to a carboy for secondary and clearing. >From: gummitch at techbook.com (Jeff Frane) >Subject: Hot Break Terminology The definition you quoted reads a lot like Noonan's but is a bit more clear. I find it interesting to point out the additional confusion that is created by the fact that in order to test for "hot break", the wort must be chilled. The stuff at the bottom after chilling, must of necessity be called the "cold break". This leaves us where I proposed several years ago, viz., the hot break is a point in time, not stuff. It would be beyond reason to call the stuff hot break while hot and cold break when cold if it is indeed the same stuff. One only knows that one had a proper "hot break" by chilling the wort and looking for its absence. The stuff on the bottom is irrelevant because you don't know if you got it all without looking where it aint no more. js Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 9:36:34 PDT From: "Donald G. Scheidt" <dgs1300 at aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com> Subject: Re: dextrose In HOMEBREW Digest #1182, Thu 15 July 1993, KLIGERMAN at herlvx.rtpnc.epa.gov (Andy Kligerman) writes: >Subject: dextrose, hot break > >F.J. Dobner writes"..my understanding of dextrose is that it is not largely >fermentable (by commonly used yeast)."... >He must be confusing dextrose with some other sugar. Glucose, dextrose, >corn sugar, and grape sugar are synonymous (The Merck Index 10th Edition) >These are all fermentable by common yeast. I wonder if someone is confusing dextrose with dextrins here. Dextrose, of course, is a sugar, and quite fermentable, thus contributing to alcohol content and priming/conditioning; dextrins are somewhat sugar-like, and contribute to body and mouthfeel, but are not very fermentable by beer yeasts. Just an attempt to clear up a little possible confusion here, certainly no flame intended. - -- __ | | __ /\ \ | Don Scheidt | /\ \ / \ \ | Boeing IASL, 777 Cab Development | / \ \ / /\ \ \ | dgs1300 at aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com | / /\ \ \ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 14:20:36 CDT From: Gene Zimmerman <ezimmerm at hp.uwsuper.edu> Subject: Hello? Anyone Home? Salutations! Is anyone getting this newsetter? I haven't recieved one for the past three days. Hello? Anyone out there? Sorry to waste the bandwidth... Gene in Duluth Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 11:04:23 PDT From: nexgen!bart at olivea.ATC.Olivetti.Com (Bart Thielges) Subject: possessed keg and 1.018 is the number of the FG So I thought I'd be smart and start with a kegging system since I could borrow most of the equipment from a friend who is in quiescent brewing mode right now. I've kegged two batches so far and had the same problem each time. The beer comes out somewhat transluscent. It sort of looks like watered down but dark chocolate milk. Also, there is a noticable spicy flavor which some people think tastes like ginger. When I racked each keg, I also bottled a pint from the batch in a Grolsch bottle. The bottled pint turned out very clear and didn't have as strong of a ginger taste. Tonight, I'm going to completely disassemble the keg and replace ALL of the rubber, including the poppets. I've got a brush to scrub out the dip tube so I think that it should be completely clean this time. However, I'm not completely confident that this keg has been excorcised from whatever bug is contaminating it, so I've "invested" in some more bottling gear. The third batch, I plan to put 1/2 into the 5 gallon Cornealius keg and the other half into bottles. Am I doing something completly stupid by only filling the keg half way ? Of course, I plan to leave the check valve open long enough after priming to allow enough CO2 to evolve and force the O2 out of the large head space, but I really don't know how long is enough time. Speaking of the check valve, I tried to remove it last night, but it seems to be made of plastic. My mental torque wrench told me that I was straining it too much for the material when I tried to remove it. Is there any recommended method for removing it ? Maybe I'll just soak the whole thing in sanitizer. On another point, all three of the batches that I have made so far (kits supplemented with various other unhopped malt extracts) have ended at a final gravity of 1.018. This seems to be a strange co-incidence since I used different amounts of ingredients each time. Also, the FG seemed stabilize rather quickly, like 4 or 5 days after pitching the dried package of yeast included with the kit. OK, now back to the yellow pages to look for an excorcist. Bart Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 07:41:18 PDT From: mike at notorious.lbl.gov (Michael P. O'Neill) Subject: international brew transport? It's been a year since following this newsletter, so if this question has been answered recently, thanks for your indulgence! I was glad to find out that the company i read about in HOMEBREW Digest #773 Tue 03 December 1991 i.e. Beers Across America, was still in business and was actually sending brews to all except maybe 4 states; but they don't (can't) do it outside the states. I'm interested in sending a sample of a few California brews to a friend I made while traveling; he lives in Finland. Anybody have any ideas as to how to do this without having to open a business and obtain a license and such? Thanks for any and all replies; please send to mike at notorious.lbl.gov Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 12:00:36 CST From: "William A Kitch" <kitchwa at bongo.cc.utexas.edu> Subject: re: more on sugar in beer In HBD #1182 Bryan L. Gros asks about sugars. Here's what I've figured out so far. I'll try to give source where appropriate. To the best of my knowledge there are two reasons for adding sugar to beer: 1) to add a certain flavor, 2) to add additional fermentables without adding much flavor. These are obviously two different purposes. In the flavoring catagory are: Brown sugar: Sucrose w/varying amounts of molasses added Molasses: What's left over from refining sugar, strength and character of flavor vary w/brand and type. Treacle: I don't know if this is simple a British term for molasses or a specific kind (help from the UK please). Anyway Lyle's treacle is called for in some British ale recipes and is readilly availble at upscale US grocery stores. Turbinado, demerara: Amber colored sugars, supposedly only partially refined. According to FDA types all sugar sold in US must be refined so I don't know what these really consists of. (Help from you FDA type or food science folks) C & H sell a product called "Wash raw sugar" which is described as "turginado-style". I haven't used it but in HBD#1141 Paul dArmond says it "doesn't give a cidery taste, and at the 1# level leaves a yummy sweet *aftertaste*" Piloncillo: Mexican brown sugar, various color availble. The ones I've found all say refined sucrose. Dark sucre-candi: Philip Seitz says as near as he can tell rock candy= sucre-candi. Piere Rajotte says in _Brewing Belgian Ales_ that sucre-candi is sucrose. The dark sucre-candi is caramelized before being crystalized. Nobody seems to have a US source. I've tried camelizing my own sucrose. It's not hard to do. I don't know how to assess the flavor added by any of these except to try one and taste the finsihed product. I recently tried a very dark piloncillo and didn't like the flavor it added--a sort of tart edge. In the adding fermentables catagory there are: Sucrose: A double sugar made of one glucose and one fructose molecule. Invert sugar is just sucrose that has already been split. It is used in confectionaries for reasons I know nothing about. Yeast must split sucrose inorder to metabolized it. This happens outside the cell wall by enzymes secreted by the yeast (per<Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu>) However, if the sugar is already inverted it's less work for the yeast. To my mind this doesn't make it more fermentable just more easily fermented. Glucose aka corn sugar: A simple sugar directly metabolized by yeast. White candi-sugar: Per Rajotte, large crystals of sucrose. There is stong consensus that too much sucrose adds a characterist cidery taste. According to Miller, it's the fructose half of sucrose that's responsible for the cidery taste. Hovever, some brewers say that even glucose will add a cidery taste in large quantities [per, cjh at diaspar.HQ.Ileaf.COM (Chip Hitchcock)] Most brewers agree that replacing maltose with glucose or sucrose in beers meant to derrive their sugar from malt is a bad idea. At best you brew will have a thin body and flavor. On the other had high gravity Belgian ales call for sugar as an adjunct. The purpose is to lighten the body and maltiness of these high gravity beers. This is one thing that makes them distinct from say Barley Wine. Rajotte says Belgian brewers may add either glucose or sucrose to their high gravity beers. Some say the already high maltose content hides the cidery flavor. Then again maybe it's the lousy weather they have there most of the year, who knows? Sante', WAK Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 08:16:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul dArmond <paulf at henson.cc.wwu.edu> Subject: re: Parking in Portland If you're coming to Portland, be ready for parking shortages. The city Fathers and Mothers decided that persuading everyone to kill their cars was a good idea for the 21st century, so they passed an ordinance that limits the number of parking spaces per downtown block. Ride the bus, eh? I called the Mariott and spoke with Kim at the front desk. Here's the deal... The Mariott has limited parking space, it all valet parking at $14 per day, if you have a room there or not... Right behind the Mariott, connected by a skybridge, is a city lot at $9 per day, plus some in/out fees. I've heard that Portland has pretty good public transit (hey, Jeff! what's it like?), so maybe that will help. Considering what a lot of us will be doing, riding the bus or light rail or whatever the heck it is that they have there might be a good idea while we're wearing the knees out of our trousers looking for more and more good beer. Paul. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 07:56:47 PDT From: tima at wv.MENTORG.COM (Tim Anderson) Subject: The last bottle In korz.digest #1182, Dave Hinz writes: >ObHomebrewComment: Don't you just HATE finishing the last bottle of a batch? >It's sort of sad to know that the whole thing is history... Not at all. It's wonderful. Once you've made a bad batch and had to pour beer down the drain (now there's something to hate!), there is great joy in knowing that every single bottle has been a source of pleasure. By the way, I use one clear bottle in each batch, and it's the last one I open. When my wife sees me trudging up the basement stairs cradling a clear bottle of beer in trembling hands, she knows to keep a reverent and respectful silence until the glass is drained. Hmmm, maybe I should us more clear bottles. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 10:08:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Tom Rush <trush at mhc.mtholyoke.edu> Subject: Hop harvest and Chico yeast I have quite a different report on my hops than the one I posted last year(large yields and lush plants) the summer has been and continues to be hostile to all growers. The drought and heat has been a disaster for farmers and home gardeners alike, the prolonged heat wave withers plants even if irrigated--it seems worse in this area since Ct,VT,NY,etc. are hurting but not as badly. Anyway, my cones are all coming early, very few, and the vines have stopped growing. The japanese beetles have returned with a vengeance, they invited potatoe beetles and I have a strange green catapillar munching on the cones and leaves(this may be a rare type of moth/ butterfly which feeds only on hop vines according to a reference book)thats all I need a "spotted-owl" endangerd worm and Sierra will checking on me. I can see where hop growers can have "feast or famine" cycles. Only consulation my "hersbrucker" is alive and well which I thought I lost last year(only grew 4 inches after being stepped on and crushed also the two Saaz I planted this year are thriving. Has anyone encounterd or has an answer to the following: I use Chico yeast cultured from SNPA, use my own hops, aerate after boiling and cooling to the point of using a sterilized chefs omelet mixer (reason follows)it foams up the wort 3-4 inches but subsides quickly and the yeast is perking overnight. The probleml is, the primary gets stuck by the second day-I transfer to the secondary VERY CAREFULLY AVOIDING FURTHER AERATION and the batch takes off again. It works so much in the secondary I can't use an airlock and have a blow-off tube in a bucket to catch the overflow. The beer comes out perfect(deeeliciuuus) but the procedure troubles me. Any suggestions or theories are welcome, -tom Return to table of contents
Date: 15 Jul 1993 10:48:44 -0600 (CST) From: CMACK at ssc.wisc.edu Subject: Smells like crap! Hi -- first I'd like to thank everybody for suggesting breweries and pubs in San Francisco and San Diego. Other folks have gone on about how helpful the people on this list are, so I'll let it go and get on with my question. I'm still relatively new to homebrewing, and on my 6th batch (an Anchor Steam clone), something odd is happening. I thought the smell in my basement was coming from somewhere else, but when I sniffed above the airlock of the primary fermenter, I almost gagged on this nasty, sulfurous odor. Maybe it's just my imagination, and the fermenter isn't actually *distended* from the gas production, but it still has me spooked about this batch's chances. (At least I don't have to worry about oxidation?) As far as I know, this was a standard extract recipe, not so different from Papazian's Steam in TNCJoHB. Can anyone tell me what's gone wrong? Thanks, Chris Mack Return to table of contents
Date: 15 Jul 1993 16:48:58 -0500 (EST) From: STBLEZA at grove.iup.edu Subject: Many Topics... Greetings All, and You Too... I have a few (heh!) brewing related questions. First: Is it possible to use high proof (150 proof, 75 % +) alcohol to sterilize equipment with? I ask because I have access to Mexican potable rubbing alcohol, and I couldn't come up with a reason not to use it (since I won't drink it, I like my health to much). Second: Doesn't anyone have any info on Kitzinger Reinzuchthefen Liquid Culture (fancy name for yeast)? I found this in a small, local winery, and wanted to know what it's charecteristics are. ANY info would be helpful... Third: Has anyone on the digest tried to use a double fermentation on beer? I heard about the process, and was thinking of trying it, but I decided to consult higher authorities first. For those un-familar to the process, you pitch a yeast with a low alcohol tolerance (ale and lager yeasts) into your primary, then wait until the fermentation slows due to alcohol abundence, transfer into a secondary, and pitch a second yeast in that has a higher tolerance (such as a wine or champagne yeast). What effects would this have? Is it at all desirable? Has anyone done this? Is there any literature on this topic (I can't find the source that gave me the idea for this)? Have I finally gone off the perverbial 'deep end'? Last, I have some gasoline to throw onto the High Gravity Brewing fire... In medieval times (circa 16th century and before), it was not uncommon for beer to be mashed, etc in a small vessel, with water added in the fermenter before fermentation started. This allowed for smaller vessels to be used up to the fermentation stage, allowing brewing to take place more readibly in the home. If they were able to create beer good enough to write ballads about that are still sung today using worts produced in this manner, seems to me that we should have no problems making good beers like this, too... White Belts Motto: Weebles Wobble but they don't Fall Down +*****************************************+***********************************+ | |1,000,000 Lemmings Can't be Wrong! | | The only thing that lets me retain |-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-| | my slender grip on reality is the |Jacobus Jager Draake | | friendship I share with my collection |(AKA J. Hunter Heinlen) | | of singing potatos. |(Bitnet:STBLEZA at IUP) | | |(Internet:STBLEZA at GROVE.IUP.EDU) | +=========================================++==================================+ WATCH THIS SPACE! DON'T LET IT GET AWAY! | The SCA... A Dream to Some, | A Nightmare to Others! Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 07:29:17 -0400 From: Rich Ryan <ryancr at install4.swin.oasis.gtegsc.com> Subject: Carboys I received numerous posts in response to my request on where to find a low cost carboy. A number of individuals suggested a Corning/Revere Factory Store. They carry 5 gallon carboys for $9. If you are interested in finding a store in your area you can call 800-999-3436 0800-2400 EST. I was able to find a few locations. Rich Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 17:25:00 EDT From: sims at pdesds1.scra.org (Jim Sims) Subject: kegging info - Help! Well, I'm taking the plunge into the world of kegs. I found 4 5-gal soda kegs (with syrup - bleech!) for $5 each, regulator for $15, Co2 tank for $20, and tap/dispenser for $15. (how are these prices, btw?) I need to know what I need to do to these tanks before using them (besides replacing all the rubber seals as someone mentioned), and where to get parts, rebuild kits, etc. I've got a batch of beer ready to bottle, er, keg right about now.... thanks, jim Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 15:37:46 PDT From: Victor Stevko (Human Genome Center, LBL) <stevko at genome.lbl.gov> Subject: Use of sucrose solutions in long-term yeast storage The purpose of putting sucrose ( or glycerol/glycerin ) in a yeast culture to be stored long-term in a freezer is to keep the yeast from exploding. That is, normally yeast can't survive freezing temperatures - the water inside the yeast freezes, breaking their outer membranes and killing them. Adding 10-15% glycerol will change the osmotic balance of the yeast and keep them from freezing to death. It should also keep your stocks liquid at freezer temperatures. This is a standard method of keeping bacterial and yeast stocks long-term in the lab, though we usually freeze to -80 C. -20 C, freezer temperature, is fine for stuff you'll use in a year or two, though. ---Vic Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 16:21:14 PDT From: toma at xcski.llnl.gov (Tom Altenbach Room 2039) Subject: Brewers Warehouse propane stove Glenn Raudins writes in HBD 1182: >re: Brewer's Warehouse > Has anyone out there bought their propane burner? It appears to be in a >ceramic base of some nature, which probably would solve the need to build a >heat shield. I have purchased two of their stoves. They are solidly constructed entirely of metal, have sufficient power to easily boil 13 gallons of wort, and are easy to control at low flame for simmering or mashing too. The base is NOT ceramic, however I do sit my stoves on top of ceramic tiles in my brewery. You can call them directly for more info. They have been very helpful to me when I have phoned, (206-527-5047). [standard disclaimers apply] Tom Altenbach Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 21:05:19 -0400 (EDT) From: SMUCKER at UTKVX.UTCC.UTK.EDU Subject: Nitrogen and Carbon Dioxide Regulators. There have been some question lately about gas regulators. Some general information: Gas regulators are all built on the same principle but with some important differences for different gases. For one thing they have different fittings, threads etc. for different gases. This is for our safety so that you don't get the wrong regulator on the wrong gas. I believe that these difference have been set up by the American Welding Society and are regulated by the Interstate Commerce Commission. As was point out several days ago (I sorry I lost the author) in the case of oxygen this is so you don't kill someone by putting a contaminated regulator on a oxygen tank in the future. Second oxygen and nitrogen regulator are built to take full cylinder pressure of 2500 psi plus a safety margin. Carbon dioxide regulators on the other hand generally have a different spring in them to account for the lower pressure from the head space gas over the liquid carbon dioxide in your cylinder. Also most carbon dioxide regulators are designed to limit freeze up, which if it occurs can allow high pressure gas or even some liquid carbon dioxide to pass. Not what you want. A good place to purchase a carbon dioxide regulator is you welding supply store. A generic brand for low flow rate should run about $ 40.00. You may have to replace the low pressure gauge because it likely will be calibrated for flow rate rather that pressure but your welding dealer will have a replacement gauge and maybe willing the swap one out. My was, but then I buy welding supplies too. Dave Smucker, Brewing beer, not making jelley!! Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 10:11:24 EDT From: kstiles at woomera.att.com Subject: Neuweiler's Stock Ale Matthew Mitchell writes: >Another excellent contract brew from Lion in Wilkes-Barre is the Neuweiler's >Stock Ale, brewed for Neuweiler's of Allentown. I think they have their >own brewery, right? They've been around a while and I never looked twice A few years ago Neuweiler's started up as an upscale-type beer contract brewed at Lion in Wilkes-Barre. They bought the name from Neuweiler's, which went out of business in the late 60's. Supposedly, the new company wanted the name only - the original Neuweiler'a was a blue collar-type beer, so they didn't use the recipes. The old brewery still stands (unused for much of anything?) in Allentown. It's a very interesting building with big copper gargoyles and beer mugs. >So is stock ale a defined style? The last one I had was the Molson Stock Ale (which had an anchor in the hexagon molson label ref to sea voyage like >The label says that the story is that the beer was reserved for stockholders That's my understanding - it was distributed to stockholders in liu of or in addition to dividends. Of course, today it is just marketing hype to imply it is a higher quality beer. I don't think it qualifies as a defined style. I agree that it's a pretty good bargain - not in the same class as, say, Stoudts, but a good deal at $12/case here in Allentown. -Kevin Stiles Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 08:43:54 CDT From: pyeatt at Texaco.COM (Larry D. Pyeatt) Subject: weevils Chuck Cox writes: > Does anyone have any experience eliminating weevils? I now only have one > living plant left, and am concerned that predators may not be effective > on a single plant. Perhaps I should simply kill the weevils by hand. This may not be of any use to you, but when I was growing up on the cotton farm in Texas, we ocassionally had infestations of boll weevils. The organic solution was to distribute ladybug eggs. There is also another insect which will prey on weevils, but I don't remember what it was. Check with your county extention agent (if you have one), maybe he will know something. Larry D. Pyeatt This article does not reflect the views ( pronounced "Johnson" ) of my employer or of myself. Any simi- Internet : pyeatt at texaco.com larity to the views of anyone, real or Voice : (713) 975-4056 fictional, is purely coincidental. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 09:28:56 EDT From: sims at pdesds1.scra.org (Jim Sims) Subject: yet another question - alternative brew vessels I was rooting around in the place i found the kegging stuff the other day, and noticed several interesting vessels. One was a 100-gallon coffeepot, complete with electric pump. There were two other vessels, with stream heating elements surrounding about a 15-20? gallon reservoir. All were stainless. Any ideas if these could be readily used for brewing? Or what I would need to consider/look out for to decide for myself? The 100 gallon coffeepot was a lot cheaper, but it wasn't obvious how to get a heating element/burner 'under' it as it's built on a(n open) stand. It does say "max temp 300 degrees F on the plate. jim Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 1993 09:40:50 EST From: Kristof_Mueller at voyager.umeres.maine.edu Subject: RE: Mint Beer Hmmm, mint beer, huh? Why I dont have a recipe, I have tries something like it. Colt .45 came out with a product called Colt .45 Cool. The first sip was tasty, but everyone I knew who attempted to drink more than 6 ounces threw up, so just be careful when you make your brew. I imagine that it could be good, but my only experience with a mint beer was not good. - --Kris Beer, Beer Starts with a B Ends with an R And has two E's Return to table of contents
Date: 16 Jul 1993 09:09:11 U From: "Westemeier*, Ed" <westemeier at pharos-tech.com> Subject: Mint in beer Ed Wolfe asks about using mint. I have very vigorous mint plants in my back yard, and use them for my annual Christmas spiced ale. I pick about two ounces of fresh mint leaves and drop them in the kettle just at the end of the boil. This gives a mild, but definitely noticeable mint flavor. If you want a strong mint flavor, I would suggest three ounces (this is for a five gallon batch). This is one of my favorite brews of the year, and I use other spices as well, but the minty note is what really makes it special for me. Ed Westemeier Cincinnati, Ohio westemeier at delphi.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 10:13:34 EDT From: "Anton Verhulst" <verhulst at zk3.dec.com> Subject: step infusions chuckm at pbn73.cv.com asks: Does anyone have a formula that will help me with Step infusions in order to hit proper temperatures. eg. I mash in a cooler tun. If I have X pounds of grain at Y degrees, how much 212 degree water must I add to raise the temp Z degrees. Given that I know X, Y, and Z all I need to find out is the 'how much'. In my experience the answer of how much is "too much". I do a protein rest using 1 quart of water to 1 pound of grain at 50C (122F). I then add 1/2 quart per pound grain of boiling water. This brings the temp up to about 60C (140F). This is a fairly reasonable mash - consistency wise. I wouldn't want to make it much thinner than that. Besides, given an 8 or 9 pound grain bill, this brings the total volume up to the limit for my 5 gallon stainless steelmash tun. What I wind up doing is puting the mash on the burner to bring the temp up (stirring constantly) to sachrification temperature. I understand that with a cooler tun, this option is not available to you unless you resort to decoction mashing. IMHO, With your set up I would recommend mashing only with fully modified malts and forgetting about step infusion. However, assuming to have the space in the mash tun and you are willing to use a much thinner mash, to answer your original question, the formula would be (check me on this HBDers): Given: - heat = temperature times mass. - absolute temerature (kelvin) is 273 plus mash temp (centigrade). - water boils at 100C. - The US system of weights and measures suck and we should join the rest of the world and convert to metric. Assumption: on the eath's surface, weight and mass are numerically identical. terms: sw = starting weight st = starting temperature (absolute) ft = final temperature (absolute) bt = boiling temperature (absolute) x = water at boiling temperature to add sw(st) + (bt)x = (sw + x)ft example: Assume 1 quart of water weighs 2 pounds - about a 10% error, but close enough. (1 gallon of water = 7.5 pounds). you have a mash of 10 pounds grain and 10 quarts water for a total weight of 30 pounds. you have a protein rest at 50C (122F) and you want to raise it to sachrifcation temperature of 67C (152F). 30(273+50) + (273+100)x = (30 + x)(273+67) 9690 + 373x = 10200 + 340x 510 = 33x x = 15.5 pounds of boiling water to add (about 2 gallons). This is off the top of my head, I haven't actually tried it - I could be wrong. This formula ignores pesky little things like heat stored by the container (ya gotta heat the mash tun as well as the mash). - --Tony Verhulst Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 09:50:22 CST From: "William A Kitch" <kitchwa at bongo.cc.utexas.edu> Subject: Hops for Lambic I was reading Mark Garetz' article on hop deterioration and storage (very informative--thanks) and it reminded me of a question I've always wanted someone to answer. I've read (Jackson and elsewhere) that the lambic brewers in Belgium use old hops, like up to 2 years old! The most sensible explanation I've read is that the aging removes most (all?) of the bittering capability of the hops but they still impart an important flavor to the beer. So my questions for you hop experts are: What's left in two year old hops? What varieties are used for lambic? Should I buy a couple of pounds of hops now and put them in my 90F garage so I can start brewing lambic-type beers in two or three years? Sante' WAK Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 08:56 MTS From: Chuck Coronella <CORONELLRJDS at CHE.UTAH.EDU> Subject: Reno BrewPubs, homebrew clubs, etc? Just found out yesterday that I'll be moving to Reno in mid August. At last I'll be able to brew legally. (Homebrewing in Utah is decades away from legalization.) So what's the beer situation out there? Brewpubs? Homebrew clubs? Microbreweries? Thanks, and looking forward to seeing you in Reno (if I can finish my dissertation in time...), Chuck Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 10:42:44 EDT From: rgarvin at btg.com (Rick Garvin (703-761-6630)) Subject: Irish Moss Another data point for Irish Moss usage. I have used it off and on over the last seven years when I remembered. It is recently that I have become a believer. This spring I began using a 15.5 gallon keg (capacity 15 gallons) as a boiler and a 48 qt Coleman cooler as a mash tun. Previously I had used a ZapAp for lautering. The switch came about to reduce HSA and increase capacity; 30 lbs vice 12-17 lbs (mash thickness dependent). Well, the classic copper manifold lautering approach does not (for me) produce as clear a run-off as the ZapAp. I started out with the cooler/copper manifold approach in 1987 and when I made the switch to ZapAp I noticed better clarity. Lately I have been using one Tablespoon of Irish Moss per 12-14 gallons of boiling wort. I have noticed a clearer wort post-boil and better clarity post-fermentation using the Irish Moss. In my next brew I will try using one Tablespoon per 5 gallons in my next batch. Alex (alexsi at microsoft.com) talks of using PolyClar successfully. I have used it in the past also with dramatic results. My experience has paralleled that of Dan Carter, BrewMeister at Oxford Brewing Co in Baltimore. They chill their infusion mashed ales, do a course DE filter and place the beer in a bright beer tank. Here they chill to 2-4C and add "two scoops" of PolyClar. What Dan feels he gains by this is prevention of chill haze without doing a sub-micron filtration thereby negatively effecting mouthfeel. Hot Break: - ------------- It is good to see someone has finally made some sense in the hot break thread. Steve (sc at vcc.com) has described exactly my observations on hot break. > The hot break begins at the beginning of the boil, > anyone unclear on this should bring an all grain > (extracts have small hot breaks) beer just to > boiling and then turn the burner down to observe > the flocculation of proteins. IMHO no hops should > be added until a hot break occurs as hop introduce > nucleation sites that would otherwise be started > by the larger proteins. This will give a brighter > beer. By the way the hot break happends when the > larger protiens come in contact with the interphase > between steam and wort cooking them just as blood > will form a solid when heated. I've seen flocs > the size of dollar bills in my 40-gal brew system > allways at the begining of the boil. In my 15 gallon boiler fired by the Kin Kooker rocket engine I see hot break within 15 minutes. For my recent 60/40 Weizen (I am bring a 5 gallon keg to Portland) I did a one hour boil before adding hops. I did indeed see protein goobers the size of canned hams within 15 minutes. Now, in summer time I use a two stage heat exchanger. I use an immersion chiller with 40 ft of 3/8" soft copper to get the wort to ~100F. Next, I have 20 ft of ice packed 3/8" copper that I gravity feed the wort through to get the final chill. on a 90F day I have beer going into my fermenters at 45F. It is really nice to see that condensation on the fermenters. Why do you care how I chill my beer? Well in the winter with only an immersion chiller I get almost no cold break. With the combo chiller I see a dusting of cold break. Make of this what you want. Summary: Hot break: happens at the beginning of the boil. Consists of coagulated proteins that are insoluble at 212F. Cold Break: happens when the beer is chilled. Consists of proteins (not necessarily coagulated) that are insoluble at pitching temperatures. Chill Haze: happens when beer is chilled to serving temperatures. This is, essentially, the "colder break" that occurs when beer is chilled below fermentation temperatures and those proteins that are left over after the cold break that can precipitate at temperatures somewhere above 32F come out of solution into suspension. See you in Portland. Cheers, Rick Rick Garvin rgarvin at btg.com BTG, Inc. Navy Programs Division, Vienna, VA 703-761-6630 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 10:24:43 CDT From: Fritz Keinert <keinert at iastate.edu> Subject: Re: Purchasing Supplies In #1183, Kristof_Mueller at voyager.umeres.maine.edu asks > I was just wondering, I am 20 years old, and plan on brewing as soon as I > get my apartment (in Sept.). I know that legally I cannot brew beer until > I'm 21, but can I buy supplies as a "minor"? It seems to me that anyone > should be able to buy a bucket and some grains. Does anyone know the laws > that apply here? Thanks for your help. The laws may vary from state to state, but it is definitely legal in Iowa to purchase brewing supplies as a minor, and even to brew and drink your own beer (in the privacy of your home)! The various alcohol laws cover purchase of alcohol and public consumption, but not this case. I think you are not allowed to give this beer to underage friends, though, even in your own home. Your best bet is to ask at a good homebrew supply store in your state; that's what I did here in Iowa. If you ask the police or some other state agency, they probably won't really know and just tell you "no, you can't do that". I found that out when I tried to call the Chicago airport customs office about details on beer importing: they are supposed to enforce the laws, but they don't really know the details themselves. - --- Fritz Keinert phone: (515) 294-5223 Department of Mathematics fax: (515) 294-5454 Iowa State University e-mail: keinert at iastate.edu Ames, IA 50011 Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1184, 07/19/93