HOMEBREW Digest #1480 Wed 20 July 1994

Digest #1479 Digest #1481

		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  WYeast packs... (pittock)
  Re: Extract Syrup to All Grain (Tel +44 784 443167)
  20L kegs (PAUL ANDREWS)
  Jap beetles and Sevin (S29033)
  Citrus Taste In Home Brew (Bruce Kiley)
  Professional brewing classes (Bruce Kiley)
  RE: Japanese Beetles (Jim Dipalma)
  Jap Beetles and predators (S29033)
  mashing in the husk (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  SAM ADAMS-was this guy for real?? (john keith hopp)
  Kriek kit (Aaron Shaw)
  Mashing (Jim Busch)
  First time caller:  Long Mash , Wyeast , Wort Cooler??? ("Joy Bill")
  Pumpernickel Stout Recipe (Nancy.Renner)
  Jim Koch (Ulick Stafford)
  Re: Jim Koch Bashing (John DeCarlo              x7116          )
  Re: Jim Koch (Bill Slack)
  Topping off the boil, San Antonio watering holes (Dan Wood)
  Re: Pseudo-Kriek (Mark A. Stevens)
  wort cooling ("Brian Ellsworth, 203-286-1606")
  rootbeer (Robert T. White)
  ...no subject... (JRT1)
  Batch priming question. (Midas Operator 3)
  Phenols in Wyeast 2007? (David Draper)
  trouble with ale recipe (Melissa Schauder)
  Beer & Sweat - Keg Competition - BJCP Exam (BeerSweat)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 17:07:58 +1000 From: pittock at rsbs8.anu.edu.au Subject: WYeast packs... I don't know about other parts, but here in Australia the "latest" WYeast strains come in foil packs without the burst-to-activate pouch (ie #3068 Weinstephan Wheat beer yeast). The Australian distributor claims they've told him that soon that's the way they will all be. IF this is the case, what are they trying to achieve? Following a similar thread on rec.crafts.brewing, do you think it is better one way or the other? Given that an "activated" pack is still not really enough to do the job efficiently on it's own (and yet some people are pitching the activated pack straight into the wort), is WYeast just forcing people to do starters for their own good? OR are they tired of getting returns of accidentally activated packs? What's the deal in the USA or elsewhere? Are the non-activating packs appearing? \\|// . o ____________ Chris Pittock 06)2495099 o-O O-o O ( Yeast, hop ) pittock at rsbs0.anu.edu.au | U | () ( & charity... ) PO Box 475 Canberra City { - } (____________) ACT 2601 Australia. /|\ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 10:56:56 +0000 From: Brian Gowland <B.Gowland at rhbnc.ac.uk> (Tel +44 784 443167) Subject: Re: Extract Syrup to All Grain In HBD 1479, RAYMUN at delphi.com writes: > Can someone give me the formula for converting extract to > all grain? > The figure I have is for converting Pale Malt quantity to extract quantity by multiplying by 0.73 - divide extract quantity by 0.73 for the reverse effect. Cheers, Brian Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 09:00:31 EDT From: pandrews at hpb.hwc.ca (PAUL ANDREWS) Subject: 20L kegs hi.. I'm looking for a source of 20L kegs for a friend here in Ottawa. Used would be nice but he'd buy new if the price is right. Thanks Paul andrews, HEalth Canada, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Return to table of contents
Date: 19 Jul 1994 09:52:27 -0400 (EDT) From: S29033%22681 at utrcgw.utc.com Subject: Jap beetles and Sevin I too have problems with Jap beetles. Last year the beetles were so bad that they stripped all the leaves off my cascade plants. I attempted to kill them passively with the pheromone (sp?) traps before the plants were stripped but it was in vain. I also planted marigolds about 6 feet away from the plants but that seemed useless -- I guess the marigolds need to be about the same height as the hops - 10-12 feet. Anyway, when I saw my hop plants being eaten right in front of me it made me sick. I didn't use any poisons on them. We moved to a different location and I took my hop roots with me (two years growth was quite a lot. The roots were everywhere). This year they came up and started climbing and just as they got to the top of the 10 foot poles, the Jap beetles started munching. I also planted trees (sweet cherry) and they went to town on those as well. I did the pheromone thing, the marigold thing, and they still chomped. Then I got mad. I usually use the Sevin dust on the my eggplant since that is a preferred bug meal. I decided to dust the trees and the hops with the dust because I couldnt take it any longer. It has been 2 weeks since I dusted them and the Jap beetles have not been back. In fact, I don't see any of them on the trees or the hops. I don't normally like to use poison for bugs since it gets rid of the good ones as well but, this time the beetles pushed me too far. The cones have just started forming and I do not plan to use the dust again unless of course the beetles come back. I think you have to wait several days after application of Sevin before you harvest. I would tend to wait longer since I don't really like Sevin in my beer. The passive methods are fine in some cases, but if you almost have to use the chemicals if you are witnessing the destruction of your plants. That is my Sevin sense worth. I do not work for Ortho, nor do I own stock in the company. Lance Stronk Sikorsky Aircraft, Stratford, CT. Return to table of contents
Date: 19 Jul 94 08:43:17 EDT From: Bruce Kiley <73551.3367 at compuserve.com> Subject: Citrus Taste In Home Brew Over the past year every batch of beer I make as a citrus taste to it. Some batches are stronger than others. How or what causes this and how do you remove it. Thanks, Bruce 73551.3367 at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: 19 Jul 94 08:47:14 EDT From: Bruce Kiley <73551.3367 at compuserve.com> Subject: Professional brewing classes Is there any place in the New England (Boston area) that offers professional brewing classes. I'm not intersted in the beginners and the how-to classes. I would like someone that offers a certificate type of program. Thanks in advance, Bruce 73551.3367 at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 10:04:07 EDT From: dipalma at sky.com (Jim Dipalma) Subject: RE: Japanese Beetles Hi All, Ulick Stafford writes: >Jim ? recommends against the application of Sevin to hops to solve a >Japanese beetle problem. I must strongly disagree. If you read my post in HBD 1477, you'll see that I did not recommend against using Sevin to solve a Japanese beetle problem. The original poster questioned whether direct application would harm the hop flowers. Since I've never done this, I passed on that part of his question. I then related an anecdote that showed how very potent Sevin is. I have no doubt that it is every bit as effective against Japanese beetles as Ulick says it is, as well as against any other living creature that crawls, flies, or walks. >You may as well feed >the Japanese beetles as spray on Safer (TM) products, I also never recommended Safer's for use against Japanese beetles. My statement was that I personally would not use anything other than Safer's on any plant which I planned to ingest. Safer's is quite effective against certain pests such as spider mites. Ulick is correct in that it is not effective against Japanese beetles. >A beetle trap did catch quite a few, but I >worried that it attracted more of the bastards than it snuffed out. Steve Scampini writes: >I have had absolutely great luck this year protecting my garden from >hordes of J. Beetles using those traps which use both a floral and a >sex pheremone (sp?) lure. I have to empty the bag at least once every >two days and have caught (no exageration) five pounds of bugs!! >Make sure you place the >trap about 30 feet away from your plants (not in amoungst them). The sex lure traps indeed work very well, though you must place them some distance away from the plants you want to protect, as Steve says. Steve's post reminded me of something I did a few years ago. The following story is not for the squeamish, so if you're so inclined, you should skip to the next article now. I had a young choke cherry tree that was being devasted by Japanese beetles. I used one of the sex lure traps, and was soon catching a bagful every other day. The instructions on the trap said to change the bag frequently, as the odor from decomposing dead beetles would repel others attracted by the lure. I started storing the bags of dead beetles for an additional day or two, just to make sure they were good and ripe, then spread them on the ground around the choke cherry. Not only was this extremely effective in repelling the beetles, I thoroughly enjoyed the irony of the plant feeding on the predatory insect. Hope I didn't spoil anyone's lunch, Jim Return to table of contents
Date: 19 Jul 1994 10:13:04 -0400 (EDT) From: S29033%22681 at utrcgw.utc.com Subject: Jap Beetles and predators On the use of the traps for Jap beetles, I hung them at least 30feet away from the hops and my cherry trees (more like 50 feet) and the traps were only somewhat successful. I did get beetle in the traps but most were on the hops. One thing I did notice before the application of Sevin. I noticed 1 (thats one) Jap beetle that was wrapped in a cocoon and a thin looking spider (like a daddy longlegs but not as big) nearby. I think that the beetles do have some predators but there was simply not enough of them in my garden to control the population. I am not an entymologist (I would be lucky if I spelled that correctly) and I would be interested in knowing what other type of predators the Jap beetles have so that I could 'introduce' them next year. Again, I don't particularly like using pesticides and would not mind if the beetles munch a leave or two but, I have to use the stuff if there is no alternative. Lance Stronk Sikorsky Aircraft, Stratford CT. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 10:15:22 EDT From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu Subject: mashing in the husk This is only very loosely related to brewing, but is an interesting application of what we do to a very real summer problem -- getting really sweet corn without growing it yourself. A friend related an experiment he did. He took an ear of corn and split it into three pieces. The first, he just boiled. The second, he soaked in 150F water for 10 minutes, then boiled it. The third he soaked in 150F water for 20 minutes and then boiled it. The third was the sweetest by far, the first was quite starchy. You can be sure I'm going to try this with the next batch of corn I buy! =Spencer in Ann Arbor, MI Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 08:23:50 -0600 (MDT) From: john keith hopp <jhopp at unm.edu> Subject: SAM ADAMS-was this guy for real?? Note: this is a summary of private postings received about SA and JK (per HBD 1477) >What's the real beef against Jim Koch <tm?>? What has been his >reprehensible behaviour so as to warrant constant derision in HBD (a >search through HBD back issues yields little detail). >As for CooBudMill(etc.), I see that they are cranking out reliable crap >and bogus ads, but SA seems much more reserved, ad-wise; quality is decent. >Plus, SA is reasonably cheap ($5-6/per) and the bottles are tough and >reusable (as Anchor has gone to crappy screw-tops). >So, what's the beef? The general consensus seems to suggest: ** Koch snarfs every bit of credit he can get for the improvements in the *variety of beers you can find in this country. The fact of the matter is *that there was already a revolution happening on the west coast, from San *Francisco all the way to Seattle; it's debatable whether he did anything *significant to move this forward. Also, there seems to be controversy surrounding his GABF "victories?" THE ADS: ** SA was the only American beer who was sold in Germany since *it was the only one to meet the German Purity Standard. First, the reason *that SA meets this criterion (which is no great feat, there's tons of *BAD german beer that is up to "standard") is that its brewed IN germany *under contract. All brewers there MUST meet the standard... ** You can just hear his whining in his ads (not his voice by the way, that's a paid actor's voice.) **Furthermore, a radio ad he ran in the northwest took a not very subtle slam at the traditional beer and agriculture of our region. I thought his ads were originally clever, with the "they spill more beer than I make in a given year" bit; but then a small micro probably brews less beer than SA spills... ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Also, his taking slams against NW micros does seem rather rude and unnecessary, a la A-B's pumpernickel stout ads. The rest of the replies involved issues of (unnecessary) litigation wielded against smaller Boston breweries for trademark infringement and/or the use of "Boston" in beer or pub names. Also, the hand-me-down patriotic recipe deal seems to be shameless--did the lite-beer inventor truly found the SA flagship beer? Many thanks to all repliers. I must note the following: I am an amateur!! I am not being paid (or coerced) to trash JK or SA!! Don't sue me!! ALSO, AN INACCURACY: I REALIZE THAT IT WAS ANOTHER CAL.MICRO. THAT WENT TO CRAPPY SCREW TOPS--APOLOGIES TO F.MAYTAG & CO. To defend good ol' JK, I reiterate that his bottles are sturdy (tho the labels tough to remove) and that the product is good at $5-6/6. However, I do offer this to all who care to read it: YOUR POWER IS IN YOUR POCKETBOOK!! SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL MICRO/PUB!! jhopp at unm.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 11:02:42 -0400 From: ar568 at freenet.carleton.ca (Aaron Shaw) Subject: Kriek kit Bill Rust inquired about the Brewferm Kriek kit. I used one of these once and found that the cherry flavour did not come through alot. I also tried their Framboise kit later on and I did not add the contents of the kit until the secondary fermentor (5 lb. of two row pale malt and 50 g of hallertau hops were used in the initial brew) and this time the raspberry taste came through quite well. Maybe it was just my Kriek kit or there very well could be a difference between the Brewferm Kriek and Framboise kits, but I would not use the kit until the secondary. Brew with your malt and wheat first. Good luck! P.S. Thanks to the MANY people who resonded to my Fruit fly post. There was none of the damn things flying around when I transfered to the secondary, so I am just praying that none of the little devils got in. - -- "Come my lad, and drink some beer!" Aaron Shaw Ottawa, Canada Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 12:00:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com> Subject: Mashing > Subject: Mash and Sparge Times > > I have been wondering about Mash and sparge times. I am new to all > grain with about a half dozen batches to my name. > > Mash > Most people seem to mash for about an hour. However, Dave Mosher's new book recommends mash times on the order of 2 to 2 1/2 hours.I've done > anywhere from 1 to 1 1/2 hours. > > What's right? How much does it vary per style or mash temperature. > Should you just do an iodine test and not worry? There are no absolutes to answer this question. A better question is "what does the brewer want to make?". This varies considerably with equipment and grain choices. Many good beers are produced using US 2 row, and mash times in the 30 minutes range. Your water chemistry may not allow conversion times this fast, so this is an area to watch if yields are low. Most malts are fully mashed after one hour at sacc. temps (150s). Many malts will exhibit rapid conversion in the 140s (what I call a beta rest, to maximize the beta amylase activity, resulting in a more fermentable wort) and if the mash is allowed to sit in this range, the beer's character will change. This is the good part of mashing, control of certain details that will affect the outcome of the beer. Experiment and use diff types of malts for diff styles, and take good notes (esp in the tasting phase to relate back to the mashing). > > Sparge > There has been some discussion of this lately, but still I wonder... I > have had extraction rates from 22 to 30. The 30 numbers are > when I use a _lot_ of water, ending up with 7 or 8 gallons, which > means a very long boil. I'm not worried about getting every last > point out of my grain, but neither do I like to waste too much. 7-8 gallons of sweet wort in the boiler for a 5 gallon batch seems perfect. Just watch for final runnings in the 1.008-1.010 range to determine when to stop sparging. > > I can control the flow easily by adjusting the faucet I placed on the > cooler. It's too soon to say for sure how much that seems to affect > the extraction. > Is slower better? I.e. turn the faucet way down? About 1 -1.5 hours is normal for small brewers (5-15 galls). > Is more water better? I.e. end up with very long boils? A typical aim is to evaporate 10% of the volume per hour during a 90 min boil. So you want 5 gallons of cast out wort, plus losses to trub and ....., say 5.5 gals, or ~22.5 Litres. Add 15%, to get ~26 litres, or 6.5+ gallons. > Should I stir more? I don't stir much now, as it seems to cause the > heat to disappear faster and I'm also concerned about HSA. > Should I be perfectly satisified with 25 points? Entirely possible, your call. If you like the beer, whats a few more cents for another pound of malt?? Good brewing, Jim Busch Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 11:30:05 cst From: "Joy Bill" <billj at mails.imed.com> Subject: First time caller: Long Mash , Wyeast , Wort Cooler??? I am a long time reader of HBD archives but just subscribed last night. Thanks for the good info in the past!!!! I am a new brewer (#3 in primary) but I made the jump to all grain after the first kit (it's my Engineering background I think). A friend that has been brewing for about 5 years suggested a single step infusion mash that takes 10 - 20 hours (he also uses alpha-amylase religiously) He clams to get 90-95% conversions. His explanation is that the mash will pass through all good temperature ranges (starting at 155 deg. and dropping to 120 deg.) during the process, thus giving the benefits of multi stage mash procedures as well as longer exposure to enzymes for starch conversation . Is there any one out there that has the same experience? I have not seen this method in books or in this forum. Is my friend all wet? I used liquid yeast (Wyeast London Ale ) in my brown ale recipe this weekend and had a near explosive experience. I started the package about 10am on Saturday (inside room temp about 72 - 75 deg.) and planned on doing the long mash over night. At about 2pm the Wyeast was off and running and I started thinking about mashing. By 6pm the package was inflated completely but not tight and I decided to proceed with the sparge and boil. I pitched the Wyeast at 1:30am Sunday morning ( the bag was tight and vented with good force when I cut the top off) but all seems to be well in the ale world now. Is there any thing I could do to anticipate the readiness of my Wyeast and control the run away scenario that I just experienced?? Will cooling the package adversely effect the yeasties by putting them to sleep or killing them?? I also want to thank all of you that have written about wort coolers and here is the design that I derived from those past conversations (plus my own twist in some areas).I built my wort cooler with 30 foot of 3/8 OD copper tubing ($0.45 / ft) and a garden hose adapter on one end (combination of fittings that only my hardware man knows for sure) The outlet sprays down my driveway (I live in a swamp, No water conservation required). I have a double coil design with the outer coil near the edge of my brew pot and an inner coil coming up through the center. I cooled 4 gal of near boiling wort to 80 deg F in 17 minutes. Tanx in advance for responses Bill Joy - billj at mails.imed.com - Master Brewer (some day) of the full line of Joy Juice Lagers and Ales. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 12:54:34 EDT From: Nancy.Renner at um.cc.umich.edu Subject: Pumpernickel Stout Recipe From *Jeff* Renner There has been some interest in my "Pumpernickel Stout" that I mentioned several issues ago, so I will share the recipe. In checking my notes, I find that it was March, 1985 (not 12 years ago). I wanted to make oatmeal stout, and (remember, we didn't have many references back then in the dark ages) the best source I found was C.J.J. Berry's "Home Brewed Stouts and Ales," 4th ed., 1970, on p. 81. It used 12 oz. rye, 6 oz. oatmeal, 8 oz. pale malt, 8 oz. black malt, 4 lb. sugar, 2 oz. hops, 2 t. brewing yeast and nutrient, 1/2 t. citric acid, and 4 gal (Imp., = 5 gal US) soft water. See what miserable information we had to make do with? I knew from Dave Line and experience that you couldn't mash all that grain with a half pound of pale malt, so I threw out everything except the oatmeal and rye, and made the following recipe. Since I am a professional baker, I used coarse rye meal, aka rye chop or pumpernickel meal, hence the name. It is the same consistency as or slightly finer than we aim for with our grist. You can get rye berries from a health food store or food coop, or even a feed and seed store (don't get mercury treated seed!). Pumpernickel Stout (5 gal at 1.054) 3/4 lb. medium ground rye berries 6 oz. quick oats 1 lb lager malt, home roasted to light brown (or substitute 1/2 lb choc. malt and 1/2 lb. pale ale or lager malt) 3 lb. lager malt 3 lb pale ale malt 1/2 lb crystal malt (I imagine this was 40 - 50^L) 3 oz black malt 3 oz. N. Brewer hops (no AA noted) Handful (1/2 oz?) Tetnanger hops for aroma I corona milled the grains. Cook the rye meal and oatmeal with 1 gal water 45 minutes, ad to 2-1/2 gal strike temp water and rest of grains to achieve mash temp of ~150^F. I believe I must have mashed higher, like 153, since I got (and would want) a dextrinous wort. I am surprised to see from my notes that I mashed for 3 hrs., longer than I do now. I do (and did) this by putting my kettle in the oven at 150^F. Sparged 7 gal, had a little trouble with it sticking, so I stirred and reset it; rye will do this, but roller milled malt should help), boiled 2 hrs to 5 gal. at 1.054 SG. Didn't note whether I boiled the hops all two hrs., probably just the last hr. Tetnanger for 10 min. steep after heat off. Counter current cooled, pitched with lots of (dry Red Star Ale) yeast from previous secondary fermenter. Open fermenter, skimmed, racked after three days, still quite active (beer filled air lock once). I continued to bubble a long time, until I finally just bottled 4 oz corn sugar a one month. No F.G. taken. This resulted in a fine, creamy rich, bitter stout (more bitter than oatmeal style, but I liked it). Over time, it became drier and overcarbonated, but was still fine. The home roasted malt gave a fine, fresh roast coffee-like aroma and taste. This is something I often do for dark beers, and it is worth it. I use an old steel stovetop popcorn popper that has a stirrer inside with a crank. You could also oven roast it. I like to use more of a lighter roasted grain for color and flavor, so I stop roasting before it is as dark as choc. malt. If I were to do this today, I would not bother with two pale malts (I was probably worried about not enough enzymes in pale ale malt), and would use a good liquid yeast (not Irish for this style), perhaps a fruity one like YeastLab Australian 01. As a matter of fact, I think I will brew up a batch this next season. If anyone out there does, let me know how it turns out! Jeff in Ann Arbor Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 12:19:09 -0500 (EST) From: ulick at ulix.rad.nd.edu (Ulick Stafford) Subject: Jim Koch There seems to be many unanswered requests for information about why Jim Koch is disliked by a number of readers of hbd. As I read it the following are pertinent. 1) A great tendency to solve problems by resorting to lawsuits, and threatening when he doesn't get his own way. Such suits are usually trivial, and in many cases a financial burden on the defendants. In many cases the suits have been of other micro breweries for daring to use such words as "Boston" or "brewing" in their advirtising. He also threatened to sue the GABF when it threatened to exclude him for gross violations of the rules they had regarding advirtising. 2) The advirtising itself - Gosh, he has such a whiny little voice and goes on about how the big brewers spill more beer in a year than he brews. 3) Describing his operation as a microbrewery, when most of his beer is contract brewed by regional breweries like Pittsbergh, Blatz-Weinhard, and that one in Utica, NY (as far as I know). Still, there are pluses. His beer is often the only decent one on sale in many bars around here, and he did send me a t-shirt, even if I do also get his propaganda. __________________________________________________________________________ 'Heineken!?! ... F#$% that s at &* ... | Ulick Stafford, Dept of Chem. Eng. Pabst Blue Ribbon!' | Notre Dame IN 46556 | ulick at darwin.cc.nd.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 14:21:53 EST From: John DeCarlo x7116 <jdecarlo at homebrew.mitre.org> Subject: Re: Jim Koch Bashing Hmmm, I see many requests for this info. If anyone wants to get into gory details, please e-mail and I will try and compile what I have. So this is just a summary, in no particular order, from my point of view. 1) Koch had ads that slammed homebrewers before A-B did. 2) Koch sued lots of places that used the name Boston (like brewpubs in Boston). Using lawyers to compete annoys some people, and using them *after* being told by a judge that you can't own the name "Boston" annoys even more people. 3) Koch subverted the GABF by using buxom females and lots of giveaways to win the popular vote and get a gold medal. In fact, it was Koch's antics that led to the elimination of the popular vote. Furthermore, his ads citing winning GABF medals were misleading (lies) until very very recently. 4) Koch likes to mislabel his beers, annoying the educated consumer. The classic example is the "Cranberry Lambic" which has literally zero in common with a lambic. There is probably more, but I grow tired of this. You can also cite positive things having a more-flavorful-than-megabrew beer so widely available, so judge for yourself. John DeCarlo, MITRE Corporation, McLean, VA--My views are my own Fidonet: 1:109/131 Internet: jdecarlo at mitre.org Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 13:44:21 EDT From: hpfcla.fc.hp.com!wslack!wrs (Bill Slack) Subject: Re: Jim Koch Several people ask what is the deal with all this Jim Koch bashing: This question comes up so often it should be put in a FAQ. Basically, the Jim Koch issue comes down to two areas of behaviour. Some people are offended by his (that is, his company's) advertising tactics with regard to lobbying for first place votes in beer festivals, claims about winning these contests, and the erroneous use of the word "lambic" in his cranberry flavored beer. While some are offended by this, others feel this puts him nowhere near the top of the worst offenders list in beer advertising. Of greater concern to some is the way he has agressively challenged other organizations in the use of what he considers to be his trade or service mark. He has subjected some local (i.e., Boston area) businesses to what some consider to be legal harrassment for using the words "Boston" and "Beer" in juxtaposition, which he maintains is an infringement of the rights of his company, the Boston Beer Company. Although he has a right to try to protect his business name, many local observers consider that he has been extreme and heavy handed in doing so. For the above reasons, coupled with some people's perception of arrogance on Koch's part, a "boycott Sam Adams" movement was popular for a while but some think it was more of a bandwagon mentality than a well considered action. To Koch's credit, many feel he was instrumental in bringing high-quality interesting beer (at least, relative to bumillercoors) to a large segment of the populace, at least here in the East. While I have my own opinions on these matters, I have tried to keep the above comments balanced and unbiased. Bill __ wrs at gozer.mv.com (Bill Slack) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 12:14:13 -0700 From: Richard B. Webb <rbw1271 at appenine.ca.boeing.com> Subject: enzymatic power of wheat malt This is how it should be. I make some outrageous statement concerning brewing, and people (very politely BTW) tell me I'm full of it. That way I can find out that I'm wrong without crushing my fragile ego. The line I wrote about wheat having "practically no enzymes" could sink me here. Spencer and Korzonas both take me to task for this statement, and I'm not afraid to admit that they seem to be right! I checked out Randy Mosher's book "The Brewer's Companion", and sho nuff, there on page 135, it mentions that wheat malt has a diastatic power rating of 49, more enzymes than Vienna, Munich, or English pale ale malt! OOOOOOOO-weee! Color me updated! Heck, if you believe Randy, even Oats got enzymes! Each of these individuals also pointed out to me that UNmalted barley and wheat (probably oats too, but who's counting?) have no enzymes. This is some sort of clue that the malting process is very important, if not essential, to the creation of enzymes. ********************** I wrote: >>1.2. 2 row Lager malt 2 degrees L >> >>This malt is also kilned at low temperatures to preserve the color >>and enzyme level. It can be lower in >>enzyme and protein level than 6-row malt, but this quality depends >>on the strain of barley used in the >>malt. This malt is high in enzyme, and is poorly modified, so it ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ (emphasis by Korzonas) Korzonas responded: >This was true years ago, but virtually all base malts these days are fully >modified. There are some exceptions, but what you get at the HB supply >store is fully modified. Also, this malt is known as "Pils" or "Pilsener" >malt. But I was under the impression that Pils or Pilsner malt was by definition (well, "poorly" modified sounds like an ethical judgement. I'll call it) less well modified, and that was why one needed to use what Dr. Lewis called a program temperature mash, as opposed to the well modified pale ale type malt, which can use the single step temperature infusion mash. I do know that the Great Western malting house does modify to "well done", and that those smarties at A-B use that type of malt almost exclusively. I thought that all barley could be 2- or 6-row (OK, there's a 4-row, but I've never seen it...), and that the degree of modification made the malt Pale (well) or Pils (not so well). That's my working definition anyway. I assume that if I by "Lager malt", be it 2 or 6 row, I must use a step mash, or I will be overwhelmed by haze and confusion, while if I have "Pale Ale malt", be it 2 or 6 row, I can get away with infusion mashing. If this meets with general agreement, I will change my document accordingly... ********************************* In a completely unrelated note, I took a friend to a total of 2 Brews Brothers meetings so far this year. After the second one, the treasurer sent my friend a nasty-gram postcard, telling him that since he is not a member of the club, he would no longer be allowed to attend meetings... My question is this. Do any other homebrew clubs (or any other type clubs for that matter...) have attendance policies for non-members? I got really mad at the treasurer, and I feel that his card was way out of line. My friend may have been willing to join the club before, but maybe now he doesn't feel like it, and I don't blame him. End of soapbox... 2 pence worth.. Rich Webb Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 14:31:56 CDT From: wood at ranger.rtsg.mot.com (Dan Wood) Subject: Topping off the boil, San Antonio watering holes Brent (the quintessential lurker) distains my sometime practice of topping off the boil, to bring a batch up to the desired volume. This practice has been particularly useful when brewing 10g batches, to maximize the headspace in my kettle prior to hot break. Brent claims that this could produce HSA, off flavors, etc. However, I've seen other HBD posts mention bringing up the boil volume. So, am I flirting with disaster, or is Brent all wet? Also, I'll be at the Hyatt Regency on Losoya street in San Antonio next week. Could someone please (quickly) suggest a couple of places to drink some good brew? TIA. Dan Wood FVHAA lifetime member wood at cig.mot.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 14:35:20 EDT From: Mark A. Stevens <stevens at stsci.edu> Subject: Re: Pseudo-Kriek In HBD 1477, Bill King (WLK.Wbst311 at xerox.com) asked about adding Briess Weizen syrup to his beers, per recipes in Miller. I don't believe that the Briess extracts are sold under their own name, which is probably why you didn't see it at your local brew shop. It's pretty commonly known though that the Northwestern extracts are Briess malts, so you could look for that. The extract is a blend of barley and wheat, to the best of my knowledge. Miller's suggestion to use 6.6 pounds seems about right to me. I just flipped through the recipes in "Homebrew Favorites" to see what other people had done with this malt and found one on page 181 by Martin Draper called "Stumpy Wheaten Ale" that calls for 6.6 pounds of the Northwestern wheat extract. Martin claims to have gotten an O.Go. of 1.040. I've brewed several batches of wheat beer with Northwestern, always with 2 boxes (6.6 pounds), and have had good results. Bottom line (IMHO) is that Miller is probably on target. Prosit! - ---Mark Stevens stevens at stsci.edu BTW: "Homebrew Favorites" is published by Storey Publishing, ISBN: 0-88266-613-4. Send me e-mail if you want info on how to get it. Return to table of contents
Date: 19 Jul 1994 17:12:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Brian Ellsworth, 203-286-1606" <ELLSWORTH%BRAVO at utrcgw.utc.com> Subject: wort cooling I'm a new subscriber to the digest, (and a new brewer for that matter!_(one batch done, one on the way!)) so if this is an old topic, please forgive me.... I just saw a thread in a previous digest about wort cooling. I suppose i'll have to dig into this a little, but in one of the books i was reading prescribed simply pouring/straining the hot wort into a carboy containing 2 or 3 gallons of cold water. Ahhh, somehow i'm getting the idea this is, (pardon me) not kool? Any suggestions? I don't mind filling the sink or a cooler with ice water and setting the brew pot into that, but building/buying and then cleaning some contraption doesn't sound appealing. Rather than clutter up the digest with this presumably old topic, private mail (/flames) might be in order. -brian ellsworth (ellsworth%bravo at utrcgw.utc.com) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 17:11:55 EDT From: white at rcc.com (Robert T. White) Subject: rootbeer Several months ago I saw a couple of recipes for rootbeer the one I was interested in used real roots instead of an extract. I had saved it but I had a hard drive failure and lost it. If anyone could repost it would be appreciated. Also, I have brewed about eight times and I seem to have the same problem. after the fermentation is complete and I was told that when your wort is done fermenting if you place it in the fridge at 34F it will cause most of the sediment to go to the bottom of the carboy. Has anyone tried this? I was thinking about trying this out with a stout that I am currently brewing. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 15:54:17 PDT From: JRT1%WPC%DCPP at bangate.pge.com Subject: ...no subject... I'm looking for a recipe for a Sapporo or Kirin style (Japanese) beer. Prefer it to be extract type. Thanks, JRT1 at PGE.COM Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 20 Jul 94 09:03:32 EST From: <mop3 at BoM.GOV.AU> (Midas Operator 3) Subject: Batch priming question. Firstly, a big thanks to all who take part in the providing quality information to the HBD, discovering HDB on the Internet has re-kindled my interest in homebrewing after a break of several years. In those (bad!?) old days it was a can of Cooper's Real Ale and a kilo of white sugar. But with the help and information I've found on this listing, I've just made my first batch using extracts. I used to prime with a teaspoon of white sugar per 750ml (26oz) bottle, but now want to use batch priming from now on. The most common quanities I've seen for American recipes call for 3/4 cup of corn sugar or 1 1/4 cup of DME. Can someone tell me how many millilitres there are to a US cup? Our metric cup, in Australia, is 250ml and the batch I've made is 5 Imperial gallons, or 23 litres, so I want to get the ratio correct. Is there any differance in the overall taste using either corn sugar or dried malt extract? And finally, what's the differance between putting the priming mix into a bottling bucket and syphoning the wort into it and just pouring the primer onto the top of the wort in the fermenter? I'm using a plastic fermenter with a tap. Using the second method will it mix in OK, or should it be stirred gently, or left to stand for a short period? TIA Stephen Hudson s.hudson at bom.gov.au PS. Many thanks to those who answered a previous question about cleaning a new wort chiller...work commitments prevented me from replying to those who answered my questions. The chiller worked very well BTW!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 20 Jul 1994 09:44:23 +1000 (EST) From: David Draper <David.Draper at mq.edu.au> Subject: Phenols in Wyeast 2007? Dear Friends, first a big thank you to all the respondents to my questions about partial mashing. The post by John Palmer that appeared a day or two later is as good a summary of the responses I got as is possible, so I won't summarize here. I consider my hand to be firmly held! Today's question: I have a batch of lager in the primary of which I am beginning to worry. I used Wyeast 2007 resurrected from my friend Brett Shorten's bottle dregs, and stepped the culture up from 250 ml to 500; at which time the starter tasted fine. Recipe (23 litres) = 3.25 kg light syrup, 250 gr 22L Cara-something (bag says -Pils but it's prob. -Vienna? The 22L is correct tho), 500 gr 15L Munich, 50 gr each wheat malt and flaked barley, 20 gr 6.1 Tettnang pellets + 15 gr 5.0 Hersbruck pellets 60 min, 20 gr 4.7 Spalt flowers 5 min. Grains were sorta mashed--my prelim to my first partial-mash--by using appropriate amount of water, raising to mash T (65C), leaving in the oven for an hour, then "sparging" using a collander. Just to get the feel, folks, I have no illusions about great extraction. Anyway, OG of 1051 fell to only 1043 in 72 hours (T = 18C for first 24, then moved to balcony at 10C for remainder), startup was <18 hrs. 48 hours later grav was only 1039, and I sipped my test-jar. Highly phenolic! I mean highly. Another 48 hours and grav reached 1030--fully seven days after pitching--and the phenolic flavor is even stronger. I am not concerned with the speed, I know lagers take a while, but the phenolic taste is most unpleasant, tastes like a wild yeast infection to me. The Q then: is 2007 known to be phenolic at these stages of fermentation? Our local brewstore owner/guru says yes, and Brett says he recalls something from the digest sometime in the past on this. Email or post, whatever you like, and thanks yet again for your continued support. Cheers, Dave in Sydney - -- ****************************************************************************** David S. Draper School of Earth Sciences, Macquarie University david.draper at mq.edu.au NSW 2109 Sydney, Australia Fax: +61-2-805-8428 Voice: +61-2-805-8347 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 21:05:17 CDT From: Melissa Schauder <S978660 at UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU> Subject: trouble with ale recipe Hello all, and thanks to the responses I received a few months ago from my first post. This time I have a question about possible bacterial infections. After much advice on purchasing a book and a hydrometer, I did both, and de- cided to follow a recipe in Papazian's "joy of homebrewing", called Avogadro's Expeditious Old Ale. I followed the recipe to the T, however, have found that my brew has an exceptionally strong sour taste to it. Looking through the book I can only assume that I have some sort of bacterial infection in my beer. I've let the brew age for 4 weeks now, and have found it to have a strong head, clarity, and a good hop flavor, however, an overwhelming sour taste that obviously does not belong there. If this is an infection, this is the first I've encountered, and am wondering what brought it on. I sanitized everything as usual, fermented for a week, etc. I'm thinking that possibly, the temp was too high when I pitched my yeast (two packets instead of one - one from one of the kits, one ale yeast bought separately). I'd appreciate any input on this, since I haven't had undrinkable brew until now. I've tasted three bottles, and thrown them out, but hate the idea of getting rid of the whole batch. ( A friend and I both shared the first bottle, knowing the risk of phenolic brew, but did not experience any side effects ). The taste is extremely bitter/sour, but does not have a moldly smell, nor taste . Neither does the beer contain any skunkiness, cidery tastes, or cloudiness. Any E-mail is appreciated. Thanks! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ melissa schauder s978660 at umslvma.umsl.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 19 Jul 94 22:33:25 EDT From: BeerSweat at aol.com Subject: Beer & Sweat - Keg Competition - BJCP Exam Lots of good stuff in the Cincinnati area on August 20th. Beer & Sweat 94, the 6th annual midsummer homebrewers' blast, will be held on Saturday, August 20th. If you've been to a prior Beer & Sweat, you won't want to miss this one. If you've never been to one, you're hereby invited. ALSO: The FIRST EVER AHA-sanctioned KEG ONLY homebrew competition will be held in conjunction with Beer & Sweat. Entrants and judges are invited to request details. ALSO: The Beer Judge Certification Exam will be held in conjunction with Beer & Sweat. Anyone interested in becoming a judge ($50 for first time takers, $30 for a retest) is invited to request details. You must pre-register by mail in advance, so please get the details now and reserve one of the LIMITED places at the exam as early as possible. To save HBD bandwidth, full details on Beer & Sweat, the B&S Keg Competition, and the BJCP exam are available by e-mail to anyone interested. Please request info from: BeerSweat at AOL.com Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1480, 07/20/94