HOMEBREW Digest #2409 Thu 01 May 1997
![[Prev HBD]](/img/previous.gif)
![[Index]](/img/index_button.gif)
![[Next HBD]](/img/next.gif)
![[Back]](/img/up_level_button.gif)
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Digest Janitor: janitor@ brew.oeonline.com
Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of
Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
URL: http://www.oeonline.com
Contents:
The only stupid question is the unasked one ("Charles Rich")
Corny Kegs (Mark_Snyder)
The slots go down! (Barrowman)
peroxide crud cleaner (Dave Whitman)
CIP Cleaning (rjlee)
Re: Corny Keg Manufactures (Dwayne McKeel)
Secondary fermentation... (Scott Northuis)
Re: Secondary fermentation... (Scott Abene)
Belgian Wheat Beer ("Ellery.Samuels")
Lemon Beer.. (Volt Computer)" <a-branro at MICROSOFT.com>
RE: Rogue Stout / 145F Rest / Gelatin as a clarifier (George De Piro)
Info about oatmeal (DAVE BRADLEY IC742 6-7932)
Great Canadian homebrew Competition (Eamonn McKernan)
HOP EXTRACT (Tel 3024534948 )
Great Canadian Homebrew Conference (Eamonn McKernan)
135F rest (John Wilkinson)
RE: Speakers at club meetings, what makes a great club (George De Piro)
Bavarian Wheat Beer (Paul Niebergall)
Re: Getting Started (Edward J. Basgall)
getting started addendum (Edward J. Basgall)
Small batch brewing, Nitrogen pushing, Part 2 ("David R. Burley")
S.claus, Yeast autolysis and attenuation Part 1 ("David R. Burley")
San Diego Brew Pubs / CO2-NO2 Tank in Fridge (Greg_T._Smith)
NOTE NEW HOMEBREW ADDRESS: brew.oeonline.com
Send articles for __publication_only__ to homebrew at brew.oeonline.com
(Articles are published in the order they are received.)
Send UNSUBSCRIBE and all other requests, ie, address change, etc.,
to homebrew-request@ brew.oeonline.com BUT PLEASE NOTE that if
you subscribed via the BITNET listserver (BEER-L at UA1VM.UA.EDU),
you must unsubscribe by sending a one line e-mail to listserv at ua1vm.ua.edu
that says: UNSUB BEER-L
Thanks to Pete Soper, Rob Gardner and all others for making the Homebrew
Digest what it is. Visit the HBD Hall of Fame at:
http://brew.oeonline.com/
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
Please don't send requests for back issues - you will be silently ignored.
For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at alpha.rollanet.org
ARCHIVES:
An archive of previous issues of this digest, as well as other beer
related information can be accessed via anonymous ftp from:
brew.oeonline.com /pub/hbd
ftp.stanford.edu /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer
AFS users can find it under
/afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer
If you do not have ftp capability you may access the files via e-mail
using the ftpmail service at gatekeeper.dec.com. For information about
this service, send an e-mail message to ftpmail at gatekeeper.dec.com with
the word "help" (without the quotes) in the body of the message.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 22:21:49 -0700
From: "Charles Rich" <riches at halcyon.com>
Subject: The only stupid question is the unasked one
In HBD 2406, Dave Burley writes:
> I have to strongly disagree with your comment about how glad we should be
> That Charlie or anyone is reporting an experiment he carried out. A bad
> experiment reported is really worse than no experiment.
It seems that Charlie Burns benefitted. The experiment, reported, is
exposed to improving remarks. We all got a more interesting datapoint from
his second experiment. Although, frankly, Charlie would be better off
bringing his mash temp to 132-135F (56-57C) and resting for protein
benefits *and* to denature peptidase enzymes, and then let it fall to
wherever it wants to while he cooks his decoc. The lower the temp the less
sugar conversion in his waiting mash and less fuel spent holding at an
unnecessarily high parking temp.
Cheerfully
Charles Rich (Seattle, USA)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:06:22 -0500
From: Mark_Snyder at WMX.COM
Subject: Corny Kegs
Mark Snyder
04-30-97 08:06 AM
Cory asked how to determine the type of kegs he received from a friend.
The best way is to measure the height. Pin lock kegs are shorter that ball
lock and are desired by some due to that fact since they will fit in the
refrigerator better. Pin lock kegs also do not usually have a manual
pressure release valve in the lid. That is not an absolute, though.
You'll be shocked at the price to replace those fittings, however.
Depending upon whether or not the kegs also included the dip tubes, you can
more than exceed the cost of a used keg. If the kegs are in relatively
good shape, determine the type of keg by measuring the height and going to
your local brewing supply and comparing to see what type you have. Then
buy a beat up used keg with good fittings (see if he has any with holes in
them and get them REAL cheap) or just buy a used keg and keep yours for
spare parts. If you're interested, Williams sells ball lock fittings ONLY
for about $16 to $20 a set. They only sell new kegs, though. Or, get
together with a friend and you can get 6 used ball lock kegs for about $20
each, shipping included, from St. Pats of Texas. Other sources are out
there and I have no affiliation with either blah, blah, blah.....
Good luck, and better brewing!
Mark Snyder
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:20:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: Barrowman at aol.com
Subject: The slots go down!
Thanks to all who responded to my question. The unanimous opinion was to put
the slots on the manifold facing down to prevent the grain bed from
compacting, to get more sweet wort and minimize uptake of fines. I have built
my mash tun in a rectangular cooler with a CPVC manifold because it is cheap.
I thought it would be good place to start as I have not made all grain beers
yet. Now I just have to figure how to set the whole thing up.....
Thanks again,
Laura
Charlotte NC
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:52:03
From: Dave Whitman <dwhitman at rohmhaas.com>
Subject: peroxide crud cleaner
Scott Dornseif used peroxide and bleach to clean a boilover, reporting good
results.
This sounds suspiciously like a dilute version of the "pirahna" cleaning
solution used in making electronic chips. Pirahna is a mixture of
concentrated sodium hydroxide and 30% hydrogen peroxide. (There are
actually several pirhana recipes; all contain 30% hydrogen peroxide, but
are mixed with sodium hydroxide, ammonia, sulfuric acid, etc). These
solutions agressively strip off any organic contamination from silicon
wafers. (Hence the nickname: they act like a school of pirhana's stripping
the meat from a cow). They're normally used hot, and you DON'T want to get
it on you.
Peroxide for home use is about 3% concentration, so your mixture is about
1/10 the strength of what's used in wafer fabs. Maybe you could call it
"guppy"?
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:01:25 -0500
From: rjlee at mmm.com
Subject: CIP Cleaning
>I have read that commercial breweries do their cleaning and
>sanitizing using a procedure called CIP (Clean In Place). Could anyone
>explain to me what the procedure is and could it be used in a Rims
>instalation?
CIP is pretty straight forward; you connect the output of tanks to a
pump and pump back into the tank thru a spray ball. CIP cleaning lines
requires a bit more than that, but basically the principal is the same.
Just recirculating cleaning solutions.
In a RIMS system, this would be easy, since you have all the components.
There may be some trouble in getting into the corners, depending on how
things were designed, but the basic procedure is:
HOT rinse
HOT caustic wash (run it to 140F or so depending on the detergents you
use; !beware! use only detergents designed for CIP or you will end up
swimming in foam.)
HOT rinse
optional (I do this all the time) acid wash followed by rinse
warm sanitize (depending on sanitizer)
Randy Lee
Viking Brewing Company
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 08:32:53 PDT
From: Dwayne McKeel <drmckeel at twave.net>
Subject: Re: Corny Keg Manufactures
In HBD#2407 Randy Shreve ask for phone numbers for corny keg
manufacturers in order to possibly get a custom made size keg. I have
answered Randy in a private e-mail also including some other
information that he might find useful, we live nearby one another.
However, I thought I would post here also as others may find this keg
information useful (yes I know the more experienced brewers are well
aware of these facts). I cannot see why one would need a custom
sized keg. Here is my reasoning: corny kegs are available in 3, 5, and
10 gal. sizes, commercial sankey kegs come in 1/4 bbl.(7.75 gal.) and
1/2 bbl.(15.5 gal.) sizes, and the euro-sankey is also widely available in
the 50l.(13.2 gal.) size. So that is 3, 5, 7.75, 10, 13.2, and 15.5 gal.
volumes available! I would think that pretty much covers the range of a
homebrewer! Considering the extra cost that a custom sized keg would
surely be, I would rather use a commercial keg, buy a tap for it and still
payout less in the end. I could be mistaken, home brewers are a very
ingenuitive lot and Randy or others may have anouther specific use for
these kegs other than kegging their beers.
Dwayne (I never meet a beer I didn't want to brew) McKeel
drmckeel at twave.net
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 09:10:00 -0600
From: Scott Northuis <scottn at sysref.com>
Subject: Secondary fermentation...
Howdy all,
I've been reading the HBD since the beginning of march '97 and brewing
since january '97. Today I got the nerve to write in and ask some
questions(please bear with me). Well, here goes....Is it necessary to
secondary ferment ales? Are there any benefits, any problems?
I think it was Charlie P. that said he leaves his beer in the secondary for
months some times before he bottles. Is this okay? If it sits this long,
will there be enough yeast left to condition the bottles when priming sugar
is added? Private e-mail is okay, unless you feel it necessary to post
here(and belittle me for my lack of experience).
Thanks in advance,
Scott Northuis (scottn at sysref.com)
Hopkins, MN
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 09:39:43 -0500
From: Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com>
Subject: Re: Secondary fermentation...
Scott Northuis <scottn at sysref.com>
Wrote:
>Is it necessary to secondary ferment ales? Are there any benefits, any
problems?
It is not necessary to always do a secondary ferment for ales. I actually
think that some ales do better with a longer primary and no secondary.
I would like to hear some responses on this subject from the collective if
anybody is up to it.
I have read in a few articles that many British breweries only primary their
ales and then age them?
Any truth to this?
>I think it was Charlie P. that said he leaves his beer in the secondary for
>months some times before he bottles. Is this okay?
I personnaly wouldn't leave any of my brews in secondary for months... but
hey, I ain't Charlie (thank God!)
I would also think that your yeast would probably fart out and need a good
kick in the ass to get started again after sitting in secondary for months.
I would also think you might get some of that dreaded "yeast burn" in there
too...
C'ya!
-Scott "I personally always brew in PLAID" Abene
################################################################
# ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT #
# Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com> #
# http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page) #
# OR #
# http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/Brew-Rat-Chat/ (Brew-Rat-Chat) #
# "Get off your dead ass and brew" #
# "If beer is liquid bread, maybe bread is solid beer" #
################################################################
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 12:16:25 EDT
From: "Ellery.Samuels" <esamuel at mvsb.nycenet.edu>
Subject: Belgian Wheat Beer
I am looking for a partial/extract recipe for a Belgian Wheat Beer. Have
checked Cat's Meow. Private e-mail is appreciated.
Thanx,
Ellery
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 09:19:41 -0700
From: "Brander Roullett (Volt Computer)" <a-branro at MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: Lemon Beer..
From: James Moncsko <jimsbrew at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Lemon Beer
>Has anyone ever made a lemon beer, sorta in the lines of Petes Summer
>Brew? Would it be possible to add 'real lemon' lemon juice going into
the
>secondary? How much? Maybe at bottling? Anybody? Thanks in advance,
I make a Lemon Pale Ale that i have been experimenting with Lemon Peel
in the primary.
1) tried peel of 1 lemon in primary - turned out pretty good, light hint
of lemon taste/
2) tried simmering it in water for 15 min, and adding to primary. -
little stronger taste
3) this week tossed lemon peel into the last 15 min of boil, and
squeezed the lemon over my funnel into the primary (this is a good way
to find out if you have any small cuts on your hands. :) - its still in
the primary so we will see whats going to happen.
I hope this helps... Recipe Below.
SUDS Recipe Report Page: 1
04/30/1997 09:15:19 Pale Moonlight Ale II
Category : American Pale Ale
Method : Extract
Starting Gravity : 1.059
Ending Gravity : 1.015
Alcohol content : 5.7%
Recipe Makes : 5.0 gallons
Total Grain : 1.50 lbs.
Color (srm) : 14.8
Efficiency : 75%
Hop IBUs : 42.9
Malts/Sugars:
1.00 lb. Crystal 60L
1.00 lb. Honey
0.50 lb. Cara-Pils Dextrine
6.00 lb. Light Malt Extract Syrup
Hops:
1.00 oz. Cascade 7.3% 60 min
1.00 oz. Cascade 7.3% 30 min
Notes:
1 pack of Wyeast 1056 Yeast
Peel of 1 lemon, Tossed in at 45 min into the boil, put into primary.
Brander (Badger) Roullett badger at nwlink.com a-branro at microsoft.com
Homepage: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger
Brewing: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/badgbeer.html
Resume: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/resume.html
- ----------------------In The SCA----------------------
Lord Frederick Badger of Amberhaven, TWIT, Squire to Sir Nicholaus
Red Tree Pursuivant-Madrone, An Tir Marshal-College of St Bunstable
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline--it
helps if you have some kind of football team, or some nuclear weapons,
but at the very least you need a beer."
-- Frank Zappa
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 12:37:01 -0700
From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com (George De Piro)
Subject: RE: Rogue Stout / 145F Rest / Gelatin as a clarifier
Hi all,
Tom Gaskell wrote about Rogue's cask-conditioned stout, describing its
hoppy character and wondering if a judge would rate it "out of style"
as a dry stout.
Well, I guess I would, unless there was a subcategory for American
stouts. If the guidelines are asking for dry, Irish-type stouts, then
hop aroma is not really appropriate. If the guideline was broadened
or split, then a hoppy American stout could be judged fairly.
For what it's worth, I find Rogue's cask stout to be to muddled, with
hops and roast malt competing for my palate's attention. Just my very
humble opinion, of course.
-----------------------------
Dave Burley responds to my post about using 145F (62C) as a main mash
resting temp during a decoction. He claims that there will be very
little alpha amylase activity, and therefore no sugars will be
produced (because beta amylase won't have substrate on which to work).
Well, enzymes don't have on/off switches; they work at a range of pH
and temperature. Both amylases will be active at 145F. Perhaps they
won't be working at maximum efficiency, but they will be working.
Also, while I don't have my books with me, I believe that somebody
wrote here that the gelatinazation temp of malted barley is below
149F. I could be wrong, but either way, there can be substantial
starch conversion at 145F.
The real kicker is that I have rested mashes at 145F with the express
purpose of producing dry beers, and guess what? IT WORKS. If the
main mash is rested at 145F (62C), you will end up with a beer that is
drier than you may have hoped.
Dave also took exception to my statement that not much starch will be
released in the decoction. This is true for most malts, because of
their high degree of modification. Decocting increases efficiency by
releasing starch that is trapped within the protein matrix of the
malt. By modifying the malt to a high degree, the maltster has broken
down much of this matrix for you. Decocting is then unnecessary, the
starch is accessible.
Again, I know from experience that if you rest the main mash in the
lower end of the saccharification range, counting on starch released
by the decoction to provide dextrins, you will be sorely disappointed.
The beer will be much drier than expected. There just isn't that much
starch released!
British pale ale malt tends to be even more well modified than modern
lager malts, so this would be amplified.
---------------------------
I have read that gelatin is not the best clarifier to use on its own,
simply because it doesn't work well. My recent experience with it is
somewhat different, however.
I had split a wort into two batches, each fermented by a different
yeast. One cleared beautifully, the other remained cloudy. I felt
that it was unlikely to be a protein/tannin haze because only one
batch exhibited it. It must be the yeast, I reasoned.
I prepared some gelatin (using the directions in the 1995 Zymurgy
Winter issue, except that I boiled it briefly) and added it to the
fermenter (glass carboy). Much to my surprise, the beer dropped clear
within a day! What was once "micro-fine" powder had become large
flocks that settled to the bottom and onto the walls of the fermenter.
I simply swirled the fermenter a bit, and it all settled to the
bottom! It was so clear that I could see detail through the carboy!
Heck, you can read a book through a full glass of it!
The point being, if you suspect that yeast is the haze-causing
culprit, gelatin seems to do a great job of dropping it out of
solution. If there are other things clouding your beer, you may need
to use other fining agents.
Have fun!
George De Piro (Nyack, NY)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 15:01:30 +0000 (GMT)
From: DAVE BRADLEY IC742 6-7932 <BRADLEY_DAVID_A at LILLY.COM>
Subject: Info about oatmeal
It comes up occasionally on the HBD: what are flaked and cut oats?
How do they differ/which need to be gelatinized via boiling?
For some answers, check out the Quaker Oats www url below:
http://www.quakeroatmeal.com/QuakerOats/FIBER.HTM
This has some historical info but also explains the terms.
Other pages here describe the various Quaker cereals and
oatmeal varieties.
Dave in Indy
Home of the 3-B Brewery, v. Ltd.
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:49:12 -0400
From: Eamonn McKernan <eamonn at atmosp.physics.utoronto.ca>
Subject: Great Canadian homebrew Competition
As I mentionned a while back, the Canadian Amateur Brewers Association
is again holding it's Great Canadian Homebrew Competition. Here are the
details that I have received...
- ----------------
It is time once again for CABA's Great Canadian Homebrew Competition.
Once again the competition is open to anyone who brews beer at home, or at
a brew on premise.
The entry deadline is Saturday May 17, 1997 at 4:00pm.
Entries can be dropped off in one of 3 cities across Canada;
Dartmouth, NS: The Brew Guys - (902) 468-9463
Toronto, ON: Upper Canada Brewing Co. - (800) 263-6160
Calgary, AB: The Wine Mine - (403) 225-1083 (plus 4 other locations).
Judging will take place on Sunday June 1, 1997 at The Upper Canada Brewing Co.
in Toronto.
Awards will be given for first, second and third at the Great Canadian Hombrew
Conference on Saturday June 7, 1997 at the Legion in Etobicoke, ON.
Classes for entry include:
CANADIAN BEER
CONTINENTAL PILSNER
GERMAN REGIONAL SPECIALTY DARK LAGERS
GERMAN REGIONAL SPECIALTY ALES
BOCK
WHEAT BEER
PALE ALE
ENGLISH BITTER
BROWN ALE
PORTER/STOUT
U.K. STRONG ALES
BELGIAN SPECIALTY BEER
FRUIT BEER
SPECIALTY BEER
BOP LAGER
BOP ALE
LOOKALIKE CLASS - UPPER CANADA WHEAT
So enter soon, enter often.
For more information on entering, stewarding, or judging, please call Richard
Oluszak at (905) 691-6241.
- --------------
I can get entry forms out to anyone interested. Just e-mail me
eamonn at atmosp.physics.utoronto.ca
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 11:25:32 -0400
From: William Lau </I=WT/G=William/S=Lau/OU=UNVAXC/ at ZENECA.tmailuk.sprint.com> (Tel 3024534948 )
Subject: HOP EXTRACT
I have a batch of beer that is severely under-bittered. It was
recommended that I try using hop extract (from I.D. Carlson) to
increase the bittering. Can anyone give me guidance on how much
(per 5 gals.)? Or provide some type of bittering potential in
HBU, IBU, % alpha, etc.? I've heard that using this extract can
be very sensitive.
Thanks,
Bill (william.lau at unvaxc.zeneca.com)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:00:42 -0400
From: Eamonn McKernan <eamonn at atmosp.physics.utoronto.ca>
Subject: Great Canadian Homebrew Conference
This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.
Send mail to mime at docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info.
- --------------86E2C3F2BBC
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE
Content-ID: <Pine.SGI.3.91.970430134936.14487E at atmosp.physics.utoronto.ca>
=09Will the fun never end? We also have a conference this summer on=20
REAL ALES. Here's the scoop...
- ----------------
The 1997 Great Canadian Homebrew Conference
June 7, 1997 at The Royal Canadian Legion, Branch 101, 3850 Lakeshore
Blvd. West, Etobicoke (Toronto), Ontario, with pre-conference dinner
Friday June 6 at The Bow & Arrow, 1954 Yonge St.
Please enclose a cheque or money order for the total amount as
determined below, payable to: The Canadian Amateur Brewers
Association. Reservations can only be secured by payment in full. We
suggest that you mail your payment no later than May 26. Inquiries may
be made at (416) 462-9981.
Please send payment to:=09CABA: 1997 GCHC
=09146 First Avenue
=09Toronto, Ontario
=09M4M 1X1
Pick up your tickets at the door of the Legion no later than 9:15 AM
Saturday June 7. (Those attending the pre-conference dinner can pick up
tickets from 7:30 PM May 6 at The Bow & Arrow).
*Please make note of times and locations as no tickets will be mailed!
...........................................................................=
.
a) Pre Conference Dinner: Friday June 6 at The Bow & Arrow, 1954 Yonge
St. Starts at 7:30pm, with dinner at 8:15pm. Includes choices of
appetizers, main course, dessert and a pint of fine draught.
=09 members at $28.00, non members at $30.00 =09=09
b) Conference: Saturday June 7. This years theme is =93Real Ae=94, which
is really what homebrewing is all about for those of you who make ales.=20
Topics to be covered are: Styles, Recipe formulation, Dry Hopping,
Cellering, Handpumps & Dispensing, new Real Ale gadgets, and discussion
on the pros and cons of dispensing with nitrogen. Speakers include
Michael Stirrup of Wellington County Brewery, Keith Hart of Hart
Breweries, Roger Eccleston of The Kingston Brewing Co., William Taggett
of the Rose & Crown, John Maxwell of Allens Restaurant, and Michael
Hancock of Denison=92s Brewing Co.=20
=09Includes a German style lunch with sausage, potato salad, cabbage=20
salad, soft pretzels and a glass of weisen. =20
=09Register at 9:15 am, Legion Hall address as above.
=09 members at $30.00, non members at $35.00
c) Conference Dinner: (not included in above conference price):=20
Catered by John Maxwell of Allens Restaurant. Featuring Avocado with
Iron Duke Mayonnaise, Dublin Lamb Shank braised in Guiness with Champ,
Baked apples with Irish Cream Liqueur.
If you prefer a vegetarian alternative, please let us know (we must
receive your request by June 2).
=09 members & spouses at $35.00, non members at $40.00=09
d) Whole Day Package: (includes (b), & (c) as above. Does not include
pre-conference dinner)
=09 members at $60.00, non members at $70.00=20
Add pro-rated membership at $15 and attend day at members price.
If you are buying tickets for a guest or spouse, please specify their
name, and which event(s) they are attending.
- -----------------
If you have any questions, please e-mail me at=20
=09eamonn at atmosp.physics.utoronto.ca
=09Cheers!
=09Eamonn McKernan
=09CABA Secretary
- --------------86E2C3F2BBC--
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 13:05:53 CDT
From: jwilkins at imtn.tpd.dsccc.com (John Wilkinson)
Subject: 135F rest
I read with interest Charley Burns' post about resting a pale ale mash at
135F and ending up with a brew lacking body.
I am surprised. I thought the 135F rest would cut up large proteins to medium
and add to body as well as head retention. I have done that on my last couple
of brews for that very reason. I haven't tried them yet so I may have an
unpleasant surprise ahead of me. I didn't decoct but raised to about 154F
with addition of boiling water. I don't think Charley said what his next rest
temp was.
Has anyone else had a similar experience?
John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas - jwilkins at imtn.dsccc.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:28:41 -0700
From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com (George De Piro)
Subject: RE: Speakers at club meetings, what makes a great club
Hi again,
I believe it was Pat Babcock who started this thread by telling us
about the great guest speakers at the Princeton area homebrew club. I
thought that some of you who are just starting your own clubs might
find this interesting, so I'll talk about some of my experience.
I have been a member of the Malted Barley Appreciation for a while
now. We're a NY city club that usually meets at a beer bar in
Brooklyn. We almost always have guest speakers from the brewing
industry. Brewers, sales reps, importers, cellarmen, etc. It really
helps to keep the meetings lively, which is important in a
metropolitan area; there is a lot of other stuff competing for
people's attention!
We get these guests simply by asking. Most brewers, etc. are happy
and excited to have a group of beer geeks ask them to talk about their
products. Most bring samples to the meetings. I should note that our
last president worked very hard and was TERRIFIC at securing guests,
which made it look easy.
Of course, it helps to be in an area with a lot of brewing industry
folks to call upon! In some areas, it may be difficult to get guests.
In my opinion, though, that is not what makes our club so great.
What sets us apart from some other clubs I have been to is that a good
percentage of our members bring homebrew to share.
That is what really makes the meetings so much fun. So even if you
live in an area devoid of commercial breweries, you can still have
great meetings!
We also keep things lively by occasionally meeting at a different
location (a brewery or restaurant), and we work hard to keep the
newsletter interesting and fun. You can check it out at
http://members.aol.com/maltydog/maltind.html
It's even got an original comic strip in each issue!
I hope this was useful to somebody, have fun!
George De Piro (President, Malted Barley Appreciation Society)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:43:34 -0500
From: Paul Niebergall <pnieb at burnsmcd.com>
Subject: Bavarian Wheat Beer
Home Brew Digester's:
Help, I am brewing a Bavarian Wheat Beer this weekend and have
already purchased and smacked a pack of Wyeast Bavarian Wheat
(3056). Then I read the much respected Yeast FAQ and saw words like
?problematic? and ?quirky? when describing this particular strain. Does
anyone out there have any suggestions for dealing with this yeast
strain?? I understand that in is a mix of s. cerevisia and s. delbruki
(sorry for the spelling on both). Am I headed for trouble? The recipe
consists of (5 gallons):
6 pounds American 6-row malted barely
4 pounds German Malted Wheat
1 pound torrified wheat
I will probably hop at a relatively low hop rate with Halertau. I am looking
for something similar to Paulaner Hefe Weizen or one of those Pinkus
varities (the ones that have the words "organic" and "home brew"
printed on the label)
I have made the above recipe last year and used Yeast Lab (W51). And
it came out perfect. The only problem is I don?t have the W51 this time.
Any help would help,
TIA
Paul Niebergall
pnieb at burnsmcd.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:16:10 -0500
From: ejb11 at psu.edu (Edward J. Basgall)
Subject: Re: Getting Started
>Greetings:
>
>I'm looking for some advice on how to get started homebrewing without
>spending thousands of dollars. I've purchased several magazines and
>books on the topic, but everybody seems to have conflicting opinions on
>the best way to get started.
>
>Any advice or comments would be appreciated.
>
>John Szwarc
>szwarc at abci.net
Greetings John,
You will probably get a zillion opinions about how to start homebrewing.
The easiest way is to spend some time with someone who is currently
brewing. They may be well advanced beyond the beginner level or they may
be beginners themselves. The basics are pretty much the same whether you
start with grain or extract. Ales from an extract kit are perhaps the
easiest for a first timer. Life can become increasing complicated only if
you let it or want to get into all grain brewing. It really depends on how
much $$ and time you have to invest.....
Basic brewing:
1.Obtain wort.
2.Boil wort with hops (many kits are pre-hopped).
3.Cool wort, remove boiling hops, (add finishing hops, a hop tea is very
easy to make).
4.Measure starting specific gravity.
5.Add yeast.
6.Leave in a relatively cool (55F to 70F) area undisturbed for 5-15 days,
until fermentaion has ceased. (This is usually determined by an unchanging
specific gravity).
7.Rack to a bottling bucket, add priming sugar.
8.bottle and set aside in cool dark place for 2-12 weeks, depending on style.
I initially started with a pre-packaged starter kit that contained:
a 6 gal fermentation bucket with lid drilled for an airlock
a 5 gal bottling bucket with spigot (the above lid fits this also)
a racking/bottling cane with 3-4 ft of tubing
a bottling tip
an airlock
a starter supply of crimp type caps
a bottle capper
a hydrometer
a basic brewing book
Other things you will need, bare minimum, in my opinion
1.a large 5-6 gal pot with a lid, ss if you can afford it or an inexpensive
canning kettle will work for a long time if you are careful and don't drop
it a lot and chip it all up (it eventually may rust).
2.an immersion thermometer for measuring temp to adjust spec grav readings
(also for measuring mash temp if you get into all grain brewing).
3.a cylinder for holding the hydrometer, glass or clear plastic.
4.a large sink or tub to put the pot of hot wort into for faster cooling
and/or a chiller coil (easily made from 25ft of 3/8" copper tubing and a
few fittings).
5.empty bottles, 12oz, 22oz, 16oz. preferably dark brown, swing top styles
are nice in that you don't need to keep buying crown caps (occassionally
you will need new gaskets). If using clear, or green bottles it is
important to minimize exposure to light, until consumed.
6.5 gal nylon mesh bag (check home building supply stores for ones that are
designed to strain paint for sprayers). These are good to put hop cones
and or specialty grains into for steeping and making teas. They are
boilable. A coffee press also works well for hop tea making.
Other useful but not necessarily essential items (you can acquire these as
you get more and more involved in your hobby)
6.a spare refrigerator
7.a 10 gal Gott water cooler with spigot (if you want to get into all grain
decoction mashing)
8.a ss mesh screen or false bottom for #7.
9.a good heavy duty ss 6 gal pot. I was lucky to find one second hand that
already had a hole drilled in it for a valve. I added a ss ball valve and
a ss screen false bottom so I can mash, sparge,
and boil all in the same pot. I do have to remove the liquid and grain to
separate containers, add back the wort and then commence to boil and add
hops. I set the whole pot in a laundry tub filled with cold water, insert
my wort chiller, this cools it down rapidly.
10.1/2 gal jugs for making yeast starters (if you're into BIG beers, you
need a BIG starter).
11.a lauter tun. (C. Papazian's New Complete Joy Of Homebrewing has an
easy to make bucket
design.)
12.some sort of sparge water spray device for all grain sparging. Homemade
or commercial.
All grain brewing will give you the least expensive product, but you have
to spend more time making it.
Cornelius kegging is another sport in itself. High initial $$, but far
easier than bottling in the long run.
hope this helps
cheers
ed basgall
SCUM trustee
State College Underground Maltsters
State College, PA
Up to the age of forty, eating is beneficial; after forty, drinking.
- The Talmud
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:28:13 -0500
From: ejb11 at psu.edu (Edward J. Basgall)
Subject: getting started addendum
Oops, I almost forgot, a good heat source for boiling. Housemates may not
appreciate your trashing the kitchen stove during a brew session. Boil
overs will occur. An extra stove, I prefer gas if you have access. A
cajun cooker heats water very quickly (also good for shrimp/crab/corn
boils). For awhile I used a coleman propane stove, next to an open
basement window. We lived in an all electric apartment. It would take a
whole cylinder of propane for each session, but it worked.
ed basgall
SCUM trustee
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:40:09 -0400
From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com>
Subject: Small batch brewing, Nitrogen pushing, Part 2
Brewsters:
Barry Finley says:
>I am curious to know if anyone brews in 1 to 2 gal batches.
No reason why you can't do this, especially with extract brewing. I used
to do this when I was developing recipes in the early days of no good
brewing books, etc.
All grain brewing small batches is of course certainly possible, just the
considerable amount of work is the same for less beer. Consider splitting a
brew into several types by using the partial mash technique with Crystal,
Vienna,Brown etc malts added to produce a variety of beer types. Thirty
minutes or so before the end of the mash, split the mash into several parts
and add various malts that have been converted to sugars at the maltster or
are highly roasted and will not contribute much starch. Adding them at
this late stage after the beta amylase has given up but the alpha amylase
is still around will give you a starch free perhaps dextrinous ( depending
on the malts used) wort, since these malts are low in ( but can still have
some) starch. Different hop additions and different yeasts will give each
beer a different taste. Expect to feel like a one-armed paper hanger when
you finish a day of brewing. See the recent issue of Zymurgy for some other
ideas.
For your Budmilloors friends I suggest a blond ale, perhaps made with
Cascades hops, as a good transition brew. You can make your kind of beer
also. Cultivate friends who like to drink your kind of beer by joining a
local brew club.
Like you, I don't drink fast enough to brew as much beer as I would like
to, so I give most of it away or have friends over, as I do with my wine.
- --------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff of Casper says:"
>One of my customers is hell bent on using nitrogen to serve his homebrew.
>He wants to know if he can carbonate the beer with straight co2 and then
>serve the beer with straight nitrogen.
He can, of course. This will work if the keg is consumed within a day and
the results will be acceptable. In fact air will work fine under these
conditions. Kept longer the beer with the air will go stale overnight. With
nitrogen or air the beer will decarbonate to the point that the solubility
of the CO2 and the partial pressure of CO2 in the gas over the beer are in
equilibrium.
The problem as you told him is that CO2 in the gas above the mix is
important to keep the beer carbonated correctly. The pressure of CO2 above
the beer must be the same ( say 5-8 psi) independent of the total pressure,
in order to keep the beer properly carbonated. Adjustment of the
carbonation during consumption of the keg is of course impossible with just
nitrogen.
Mixed gases are more expensive than either CO2 or nitrogen in my
experience. How about the cost of the extra regulators, etc.? I think he
needs to sit down with a paper and pencil ( or his computer) and figure out
what the total cost of force carbonating ( most expensive method) and
delivering a keg really is. It is not that expensive and a heck of a lot
less trouble to use just CO2 than using two different types of gases.
You could also suggest that he carbonate his kegs naturally with the
addition of 4 ounces of sugar. This will substantially reduce the use of
CO2. I do this, especially with lagers, with excellent results.
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Keep on brewin'
Dave Burley
Kinnelon, NJ 07405
103164.3202 at compuserve.com
Dave_Burley at compuserve.com
Voice e-mail OK
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:40:05 -0400
From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com>
Subject: S.claus, Yeast autolysis and attenuation Part 1
Brewsters:
Steve Claussen - I have still have had no success delivering e-mail to
either address. Are you filtering messages received or something?
sclaus4699 at aol.Com did not work. Confirm this address with me.
- ---------------------------------------------------------
Nathan L. Kanous II says:
>"Dave Bradley asks about autolysis in his beers brewed with Wyeast London
>And Thames Valley yeasts. Dave, I think I have noticed the same problem
>With these yeasts. I didn't know what to call it, but I guess it does
>?Amount to "yeast bite"."
Nathan and Dave, I believe there are perhaps at least two factors here
confused by people using the term "yeast bite" two different ways:
1) The sharp "acidic" taste ( side of the tongue) associated with some
yeast strains (not to be confused with a lacto infection).
2) The bitter (M&BS, v 2. p 539) ,top of tongue, taste of autolysis from
yeast left in contact with beer too long
This latter use is the preferred use of the term "yeast bite" by
professionals.
If it is sharp and gets better with time then I believe it has to be #1 in
your case.
I suggest you try this simple test. Flocculate the yeast in a small sample
of beer with gelatin and see if the taste goes away. If it does, it is
obviously due to the presence of yeast. By doing a test at various levels
you can develop an appropriate minimum addition level to the main body of
the beer. Many ale yeasts contain several strains to avoid the problem of
poor attenuation ( see below) . Generally one of these strains is a
powdery yeast to keep the whole thing agitated. It can get out of whack
population percentage- wise after several uses of the yeast if you are
making beer that is not similar to the variety for which it is normally
employed. Or the temperature is different or the fermenter is a different
depth, medium on which the yeast is grown, cropping technique, etc., etc.
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nathan says :
>My question is
>this, which is more important for dictating attenuation, mashing
>schedule or yeast strain?
My favorite subject of late in private e-mail.
There seems to be two opposite opinions 1) attenuation is a basic yeast
strain property 2)attenuation is dependent on the physical condition of
the ferment including agitation.
Wyeast publishes a long list of their yeasts and one descriptor is the
degree of attentuation. We sometimes throw this term around here like it
means something definite, rather than a general guideline of how the yeast
will behave in a typical small fermentation. I will give Wyeast the
benefit of the doubt and assume that this is how they intend the term to be
used. If this is the case they should publish this definition, since it has
created a lot of confusion.
DeClerk says that attenuation can be increased with ANY yeast up to the
point that 100% of the fermentable sugars are gone in normal worts simply
by agitation or re-pitching, since the flocculation of these yeast and
disappearance from the beer by precipitation or frothing is the cause of
the incomplete fermentation of fermentable sugars. Therefore, it looks
like a yeast strain habit to flocculate or become powdery that controls
attenuation. This could be affected by many things including pH,
temperature, OG, alcohol content, etc.
A third issue is the fact that certain lager yeast can ferment some trioses
( some of the "dextrins") under starvation conditions, whereas most beer
yeasts cannot.
So as I see it, there are two basic things outside of the biochemistry of
the yeast which control "attenuation" 1) the formation of dextrins which
are unfermentable by most yeasts - this is controlled by mash conditions
2) incomplete fermentation of the fermentable sugars like dextrose and
maltose. - this is yeast strain dependent and is the source of the Wyeast
tables. DeClerk believes this is caused by premature flocculation.
The problem comes in because we talk about attenuation as a clinical
diagnosis based on the SG
There are two causes of an FG greater than 1.000- one yeast/fermentation
condition related and the other mash conditions related, as Nathan's
question implies.
How can we distinguish the two types of causes? We can measure the
reducible ( approximately = fermentable) sugars with Clinitest. A high
reading ( say >1/2%) on Clinitest will tell you that the yeast did not
finish the fermentable sugars. Agitation or repitching and raising the
temperature a bit will likely solve the problem.
A dry result (say <=1/4%) on Clinitest will tell you that the FG is due to
the dextrins in the beer as a result of the mash conditions.
Producing a beer which is completely fermented out is important to long
term stability against bacterial growth. Using the FG is not an acceptable
method of determining the actual degree of attenuation of fermentable
sugars.
- --------------------------------------------------------------
Keep on brewin'
Dave Burley
Kinnelon, NJ 07405
103164.3202 at compuserve.com
Dave_Burley at compuserve.com
Voice e-mail OK
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 17:36:38 EDT
From: Greg_T._Smith at notes.pw.com
Subject: San Diego Brew Pubs / CO2-NO2 Tank in Fridge
I am headed to San Diego this weekend and of course I am
interested in visiting a brew pub. Right now, the plan is
to go to Columbia Brew House (is that the right name?).
Are there any others, that are better-recommended?
I posted a note a couple of days ago asking about putting a
CO2 tank in my fridge with my kegs. I want to thank those
who responded to me. Yesterday, a friend of mine asked
about putting a CO2-NO2 tank in the fridge. I told him it
should be fine, based on the responses I received about my
CO2 tank. But since I am posting anyway, I thought I would
ask to be sure I am not giving out wrong information.
Replying here or private e-mail are both fine.
TIA again,
Greg Smith
'BarnBrew Brewery'
Claryville, NY
Return to table of contents