HOMEBREW Digest #2672 Fri 27 March 1998

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Construction Details for the NHE HLT (Kyle Druey)
  Oxygenation (Al Korzonas)
  distilled water yeats storage ("David Hill")
  Re: Offensive behavior ("Tom Ayres")
  Re: Offensive behavior ("Tom Ayres")
  IS 65 pubcrawl (kathy)
  Its PirAAT stupid, Not PIrate! (Charles Burns)
  Re:  Recipe Help ("Charles L. Ehlers")
  Re: Rust Stainless ("Patrick Acree")
  Hemp ale? (Jon Macleod)
  dryhopping/CO2 release ("Emily & Drew")
  Guinness Lactic (Brad McMahon)
  One-Step sanitizer ("J.W. Schnaidt")
  B-Brite Info Needed ("Randy A. Shreve")
  alcohol bite (Henry Paine)
  Low Flow Out of Boiler (Bryan Thompson)
  Sake ("David R. Burley")
  Re: Even Mash Temp (Mark Rogerson)
  More politics: Do you want to get arrested after 2 beers? ("Frank Conway")
  Prize Winner ("Michael R. Tucker")
  London bells are ringing (Dave Sapsis)
  Re: Silicone Tubing (Spencer W Thomas)
  RE: Even Mash Temp (John Wilkinson)
  Metal Scratching Glass - NO ("Barry Browne")
  hop tea haze (James R. Layton 972.952.3718 JLAY)
  re:Legislating morality (bb)
  apology for offensive behaviour (Ken Jucks, ph # 617-496-7580)
  Priming/Melanoidin Malt (bob_poirier)
  Grand Cru style? (Ted_Manahan)
  lager time vs temp ("David Hill")
  Munich Dunkel (Matthew Arnold)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 12:34:06 -0800 From: Kyle Druey <druey at ibm.net> Subject: Construction Details for the NHE HLT Fellow Brewsters: Some folks are requesting more details on my No Hands Electric Hot Liquor Tank. This gadget consists of a plastic bucket, ball valve, electric heating element, thermometer, DC motor stirrer, and miscellaneous electrical controls. The advantage of the NHE HLT is that you don't need a stove or burner to heat the sparge water, and you don't have to stir the sparge water to evenly distribute the temperature and mix in the lactic acid for acidification. Plastic Bucket - I am using a 6.5 gallon plastic bucket that is sold by William's Brewing as a bottling bucket. The plastic insulates the heat pretty good and is clear enough so that you can see the water level. Being "see through" eliminates the need for a sight gauge. Ball Valve - This is a Kitz 3/8" brass/bronze threaded ball valve. You use a 0.625" hole saw to drill the port in the bucket. Attach a close nipple onto the valve, insert through the hole, and secure on the inside with a brass hex lock nut. The outside of the valve that meets the bucket is then sealed with silicone. This silicone in a tube is a gadgeteer's best friend, it is nontoxic and will prevent hot water and hot wort from seeping past fittings. Heating Element - I use a 3500 W copper plated with tin heating element that is commonly found in home improvement stores. The 3500 W element was the largest size that will fit inside the 10" diameter bucket, and provides a temp rise rate of a little over 1 deg F per minute. This temp rise rate is barely passable, and works out fine for this application. Use a 1.25" hole saw to drill a hole on the side of the bucket. Insert the element through the hole and tighten with a brass hex lock nut. Be sure to use the rubber gasket that comes with the element. Put a bead of silocone round the perimeter of the element (on outside of bucket). Drill a hole through the center of a 1" PVC end cap, insert wires through the end cap hole and secure on to element studs, and secure cap on top of element with silicone. Thermometer - I use a digital readout thermometer that is commonly found at homebrew shops. It has an accuracy of +/- 2 deg F. The thermometer is secured to the bucket with a 1/4" X 3/8" compression fitting, Drill a 3/8" hole in the bucket, insert the 1/4" side through the hole, and tighten with the 1/4" threaded nut that comes with the fitting. Buy a 3/8" brass compression end cap, drill a 1/8" hole in the center, and insert the thermometer stem through the hole. Slide onto the stem a 1/8" ID rubber O ring, and them slide on top of that a size 00 beveled rubber faucet washer. Then insert the stem through the fitting and hand tighten the 3/8" end cap. Put a bead of silicone around the outside of the fitting to seal it. DC Motor - CD Pritchard gave me a tip on this one, it is a 12 V DC gear motor than can be purchased at the Surplus Center for $5.95, part number 5-1162, telephone 800 488 3407. The motor cranks at 70 rpm on 12V DC 200 mA. The power supply is an AC to DC converter from Radio Shack that is rated for 300 mA, and has a variable voltage from 1.5V to 12V, which gives you a rpm range of 6 rpm to the max 70 rpm. The hardest part for me was coupling the stirring shaft to the motor shaft. I kinda "oakie rigged" this but I used a #14 copper grounding wire terminal/coupling, these are commonly found at home improvement stores. The coupling is tightened onto the motor shaft, and a 1/2"length of copper pipe is pinned to the ear of the terminal/coupling. The rotation is a little eccentric, but it works, and I am guessing the slow speeds will not damage the motor. Attach (solder or epoxy) a copper Tee onto the end of the stirring shaft. Onto each side of the Tee I attached stir blades that are 3" lengths of 1/2" soft copper tubing that was pounded flat on most of the length. The other end was left round and was inserted into a 1/2" X 3/8" flush brass bushing which was attached to the Tee. The stir blades were then cocked at 45 degree angles and faced down toward the heating element. Controls - The heating element is controlled with a $20 1000W dimmer switch. The motor is controlled with the adapter, but I tied in an on/off switch for convenience. I found that I don't need the motor running all the time, just when I add in acid, and when I am at my set temp. All this is of course first tied into a GFCI. I drilled a 1/2" hole in top of the lid for acid additions, and close the hole with a #2 solid stopper. Motor Mounting - On the bottom of the motor are three round recesses that are used to secure rivets for the top of the motor case. You can screw #6 stainless metal screws into the recesses to secure the motor to the lid. I need to improve on this because the plastic lid deforms a little and does not provide a flat mouting for the motor, but it works for now. I pirated this design from the CD's web page: http://chattanooga.net/~cdp/boiler.htm and Kenny Eddy's web page: http://members.aol.com/kennyeddy/ As I mentioned, this would be a good project to get your feet wet before you build a RIMS. I left several "minor details" out, but I know that sometimes these can make all the difference. Send private email if you have any questions. Kyle Druey Bakersfield, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 14:01:40 -0600 (CST) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Oxygenation Dave writes: >AJ DeLange, I believe, once commented >that oxygenation of the cold wort would produce oxygenated >species like aldehydes which he could smell. Presumably >these get chewed up or purged to a large extent during >fermentation or may be part of the background for ales. >Lager yeast can be aggressive towards certain aldehydes. I'm quite certain neither AJ nor anyone posted this. Further oxygenation *AFTER* fermentation has begun can oxidise some of the alcohols produced to aldehydes. You are probably thinking of oxygenation/aeration *DURING* fermentation. This indeed can raise aldehyde levels to noticeable levels. >For many years I did not oxygenate and pitched small >quantities of yeast and made good beer. I think I got away >with it because I use an open fermentation style and the >12 hours (in those days) to start of fermentation provided the >opportunity for this 5 gallon batch to get oxygenated. Can someone who has a Dissolved Oxygen meter please see how much oxygen still water picks up over the course of 12 hours? I'll bet you could simply boil some water, gently pour it into a fermenter and start measuring when the temp drops to 90F or so. My gut feeling is that very little oxygen gets dissolved this way in 12 hours. Dave is right, however, that if you don't repitch and you pitch big starters to begin with (dry yeast is *heavily* oxygenated before drying), you can *get away with* very little oxygenation of the wort. I still do... Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com My new website (still under construction, but up-and-running): http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:29:16 +1000 From: "David Hill" <davidh at melbpc.org.au> Subject: distilled water yeats storage What are the advantages of yeast storage under distilled water compared with just holding a bottle of beer in the fridge? Recovering yeast from a bottle conditioned beer and multiplying up to a starter or doing the same from a sample stored under distilled water entail around the same amount of work, time and material. Is there any real difference in the expected viable storage time, and stability of the yeast? Many thanks for the group's thoughts. ========= Many thanks also to those who have recently responded to my questions re chest freezers, and rice syrup. I just hope that my occasional (very occasional) answers almost compensate for the questions. This newsgroup is a great source of information, and good will, especial thanks to the janitors for doing so much to keep it that way. David Hill. davidh at melbpc.org.au :-)> David Hill. davidh at melbpc.org.au :-)> Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:56:18 -0500 From: "Tom Ayres" <tom at unitedwaycc.org> Subject: Re: Offensive behavior Bill-- On second thought, the reference to Mr. O'Connor's brewing partner must have been a data base error. Satan, it seems, was judging the lambics. Cheers again, Tom Ayres Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:54:37 -0500 From: "Tom Ayres" <tom at unitedwaycc.org> Subject: Re: Offensive behavior Hmmmm . . . and EYE think everyone needs to lighten up. Shades of the Great Massachusetts-Maine Homebrew Wars again. Next thing you know Victor Belligerent will be coming out of the woodwork as well. Hey, everybody . . . GET A LIFE! Cheers, Tom Ayres Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 20:41:41 -0500 From: kathy <kbooth at scnc.waverly.k12.mi.us> Subject: IS 65 pubcrawl Help.....Apr 4-12 my schoolteacher wife insists we find warm sand for her to wiggle her frosted Michigan toes in to gain strength to survive until summer vacation. Our pub crawl will be Interstate 69/65 to Alabama Shores State Park. We've explored Nashville's brewpubs and will stop at dave miller's pub. Done the Oldenberg museum/pub/brewery at Louisville, KY, but would welcome suggestions for "don't miss" spots along the IS 65. Also, will "spicy-assed mudbugs" be being served along the Alabama Gulf in April? Will Kenneth Starr investigate if they are? Gotta go bottle my kolsch and abbey triple. cheers, jim booth, lansing, mi Privately of course at kbooth at waverly.k12.mi.us and sorry but I don't need any designated driver/passengers for the week Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 18:15 PST From: cburns at egusd.k12.ca.us (Charles Burns) Subject: Its PirAAT stupid, Not PIrate! Jeez, I was just trying to broaden my Belgian horizons a bit. But let me start at the beginning It was to be our first "official" judging as now Recognized beer judges. We passed the test, got our certificates in the mail and we were ready to judge the preliminary round of the World Cup of HomeBrew. This year the World Cup is more important due to the nature of it being one of the qualifiers for the Masters Championship of Amateur Brewers (MCAB). So early Saturday (7:00 am) I met Beth and Craig at the local park n ride and we take off to Berzerkeley. Craig brought his Thompsons map book and so we decided on a scenic route through the Sacramento River Delta to a BART station in Pittsburg no less. We didnt have to be there until 9:30 so we knew we had plenty of time. We did go by the old "River Haus" a German restaurant and bar (Spaten on Tap) on the river and also the old Ryde Hotel which continues to keep the 1930s atmosphere and decor alive. Well have to go back later in the day sometime when theyre open. Eventually we got to Pittsburg and found the ugliest looking train station in history. Looks more like a federal penitentiary than a public transportation port. After a losing battle with the ticket machine (obviously designed by an idiot - or a homebrewer gadget freak after a few too many brews) we got downstairs to the platform. Only to wait 20 minutes for a train. About this time Craig and I were checking our watches and deciding there was no way wed make it by 9:30 to Berkeley. Sure enough, we left Pittsburg at 9:10 for a 30 minute train ride. And Craig being the navigator, we followed him from the train station about 5 blocks the wrong direction after arriving in Berkeley. Eventually we got turned around and made it to Barclays just in time for the last bagel and cup of coffee. Dave Klein said 9:30, knowing wed all get there by 10. Barleywines! Both Beth and I got assigned to English Barleywines (separate flights) and Craig got the honor of judging Scottish Exports with Dave Sapsis. First time official judging and we got the strongest beers of all! What luck! It was great. Flight of 10 Barleywines. My partner Troy had been juding for a couple of years and he helped me a lot with aromas. The sinus surgery I had 5 years ago left me aroma challenged. It was challenging and after the 7th one, it was palette cleansing time. Troy showed me how to use the bread as a filter for the nose (breath deep through a piece of bread) to cleanse the nostrils. I also need to remember to put my pencil down when attempting to swirl the cup and smell. I kept getting a nostril full of pencil erasure (what a stink). We ended up passing 5 beers to the finals and Beths group sent 4. They were all pretty good examples of the style. Then we had lunch (free!) and of course spent an hour talking about BEER. Craig had called Dave Garrett who lives in Berzerkeley and was a founding father of our homebrew club (HAZE) and made arrangements to meet him that afternoon. Randy from Modesto (who took and passed the test same time Beth and I did) offered us a ride in his pickup, so off we all 4 went to Pacific Coast Brewery. So we order a round and some food waiting for Dave. Well, Dave shows up with his new wife and her ex-husband (dont ask). Neither of them speak much english but they all enjoy and drink beer. After a round of the Pacific Imperial Stout we get to be great friends (we also got fairly polluted). For my last beer I decided to order the Belgian Tripel they had on tap as a guest beer. Piraat. Well, when the waitress asked for my order I said "Ill take a pint of the Pirate". At least 3 people nearly yelled "Its PirAAT`, NOT Pi`rate". Humbled again in front of the "experts". Oh well, all I wanted to do was to expand my experience with Belgian beers. It was a wonderful Tripel by the way and I got totally wasted finishing the pint (after spilling it on Randy who wanted and got a taste). This story is beginning to get too long so to keep it short, we all hopped in Daves 300 year old station wagon (except Randy who had enough sense to head for home) and headed over to Jack London Square. Theres a nice little bar there called "First and Last Chance". Nothing in that bar is at right angles or flat. The bar is tilted at least 20 degrees, along with the floor. Its extremely old and apparently never been repaired since the 1906 earthquake. I had some kind of ale but dont remember much. From there we stumbled over to the local Beverages and More and each picked out 3 or 4 excellent beers to sample. Piled back into the station wagon and headed over to Daves apartment. A classic. Kitchen on first floor (it IS the first floor), bathroom is the second floor, bedroom and living room on third floor. Reminded me of when I was first married (Dave and Tako were married only 3 months ago). Drank some more beers and then I stopped - I knew I had to drive from Pittsburg to Placerville yet. We watched and listened to some videos that Dave made (hes a camera expert) of Tako and Mako (the ex) and their blues band jam sessions. Dave had been experimenting with the shutter speed which made things blur just enough to convince us we were all more drunk than we thought (and that was pretty wasted anyway). And Mako the ex-husband/guitar player demonstrated incredible cooking skill. Rustled us all up an incredibly delicious Japanese dinner. Some kind of noodles with seafood (but no fork) and a bean curd soup that was to DIE FOR. That and a cup of fresh ground vienna roast coffee and I was on my way to getting ready to drive. A 15 minute walk to the nearest BART station, about 45 minute train ride and 1.5 hour drive and we made it back home about 1:30 am on Sunday. Yes, beer judging is tough, but somebodys got to do it. And next week is the finals! YeeHaw! Charley (ready for WC finals) in N. Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 21:56:50 -0600 From: "Charles L. Ehlers" <clehlers at flinthills.com> Subject: Re: Recipe Help <<Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:43:17 -0500 From: Jonathan Ingram <jgi105 at psu.edu> Subject: Recipe Help I took a recipe from Papazian's book, it calls for 2.5 lbs honey, 3.5 lbs light malt, 4 oz ginger root. I was going to add 3/4 lb Crystal malt, and I'm not sure which Wyeast to use, I'm thinking American Ale Yeast. Any suggestions would be appreciated. -Jon>> Jon, If you're going for an Ale, Wyeast 1056, American, AKA "Chico", will work well. However, as it's floculation is low to medium, you may not get beautiful clarity. I've used 1056 several times and have never had cloudy beer, but not always as clear as I'd like. You could also try Wyeast 1272, American Ale II, which is supposed to be fruitier and more floculant. I'm enjoying an ale I fermented w/ that. Quite nice and beautifully clear. Not sure why you want to add the Crystal Malt--color or body? Consider Carapils instead. This recipe can produce a beautifully clear, light colored, nicely flavored beer. Actually, try it first w/o any specialty grains. You can also lager. Strongly recommend WYeast North American (don't have the number) for this recipe if you do. This is basically C. Papazian's "Rocky Racoon Crystal Honey Lager" w/ ginger added. The basic Rocky Racoon recipe makes a good brew in itself. Interesting story. I brewed a batch about a year ago. Found a bottle last week that had sat in a corner and by this time was pretty well skunked. Tasted just like a Heineken. Couldn't believe it. Cheers! Charles Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 20:07:48 -0800 From: "Patrick Acree" <pacree at proaxis.com> Subject: Re: Rust Stainless Whatever you do DON'T use a wire wheel on that rust, it will only imbed tiny bits of non-stainless steel in you stainless and cause more rust. This is from personal experience. Use a green Scotch scouring pad. To restore the keg it will have to be "passivated". This is a process using acid, not being a CE, I don't remember which type. It can be done a most large metal finishing places. I live about 80 miles from Portland, OR and that was the closest place to get mine done, so I got another one and use the rusty keg for a crab boiler. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 22:25:55 -0500 From: marli at bbs2.rmrc.net (Jon Macleod) Subject: Hemp ale? Has anyone out there tried making a beer using hemp seeds (a la Hempen Ale)? I'm curious as to the amount of seeds to use, and how/when to use them? Mike Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 23:36:30 PST From: "Emily & Drew" <eneufeld at michianatoday.com> Subject: dryhopping/CO2 release I brewed an American pale ale on Friday, March 13 and racked to secondary on Sunday, March 22. I am writing now because I dry hopped a few minutes ago and had a very strange thing happen. As soon as the muslin bag filled with 1 oz. of hops and marbles sunk to the bottom, there was a spontaneous release of CO2 which formed a head of 1 1/2 inches on top of the beer. When I put the airlock back on, it began to bubble at a very rapid pace. Did this just happen because I over weighted my hop bag with marbles which caused it to sink rapidly to the bottom like a rock? Note I noticed a lot of CO2 in solution when racking from primary to secondary (at least I hope it was CO2 and not air). Also note that I had boiled the marbles and the hop bag as well as give the marbles a light iodophor rinse. I am concerned that I may have inadvertantly oxygenated the beer at this point, and that this release of CO2 may scrub out the aroma of my dry hops. I would very much like any comments on this mystery. This is the first time this has happened in the over ten batches I have dry hopped. Thanks in advance. Drew Buscareno Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 20:10:34 +1000 From: Brad McMahon <brad at sa.apana.org.au> Subject: Guinness Lactic * "Draft" Guiness and Guinness Extra Stout are NOT soured "according to sources at Guinness USA and at the St. James Gate brewery." I nearly laughed at this. Then I ran to get my source book, and found that yes, this may be correct! "There are more than nineteen versions of Guinness stout brewed world-wide today ... and the remarkable Foreign Extra Stout is sold in fifty-five countries and brewed under licence in forty-four. Ten million pints of Guinness in all its forms are drunk everyday throughout the world. Foreign Extra Stout, FES for short, ... is stored in the [two old oak] vats for one to three months where it picks up lactic flavours from the action of wild Brettanomyces yeasts. This is stale beer in the historic meaning of the word. It is blended with young stout and then the bottles are stored for another month before being released for sale." Protz,R.,The Ale Trail,Eric Dobby Publishing, Kent, 1995. pp174-6. Protz then mentions that foreign brewed versions of FES get a "secret ingredient" in powder or syrup form to add to the wort, this is probably the lactic wort extract. He then mentions the other forms of Guinness, including Original, Draught and Export Draught. He goes into detail of their composition and taste, and does not mention any lactic or other sour notes. Specifically with Draught he mentions the 45-53 IBU and dark, bitter malts. Could this be the tang? So there! Speaking of this black gold, there has been something I have been meaning to ask about Draught Guinness in the US. I have had Draught in two separate pubs (whoops, bars) in New York including an "Irish" bar, and I was most disappointed. Compared to the stuff imported to Australia, and the stuff I had had in the UK, the stuff I had was significantly lighter in body, and sweeter from lower bitterness levels. This was confirmed by a friend of mine who had just come over from Dublin. Yet, the bar staff (who got upset when I asked them to pour it properly, i.e. with the settling period) assured me it was imported. We nearly pushed it back across the bar on both occasions, and in fact we couldn't finish them we were so upset with not getting the real thing, plus they tasted terrible (they were not off, however.) Do Guinness brew specifically for the US market? Can anybody who has drunk Guinness outside the US debunk or validate my claim to the taste difference? - -- Brad McMahon Adelaide, South Australia brad at sa.apana.org.au PGP Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 06:57:43 -0600 From: "J.W. Schnaidt" <tuba at gwtc.net> Subject: One-Step sanitizer In HBD #2671, Brent Oberlin wrote: >I began using One Step sanitizer about 2 years ago. The first >time that I used it was the first time I had a batch that went bad. >I switched back to bleach and everything was ok. Once again I fell >for the One Step sanitizer and found that I had 3 batches in a row >go bad. I called a different homebrew store and found that they >had discontinued selling it because of customer complaints from >bad batches. As another data point, I've used One-Step exclusively since I began brewing 2 years ago. To date I've made 14 batches, some extract and some all grain, using it as my only sanitizer. I've never had an infection. Personally, I wouldn't use anything except One-Step. Go figure. Jim Schnaidt tuba at gwtc.net Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:02:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Randy A. Shreve" <rashreve at interpath.com> Subject: B-Brite Info Needed B-brite has been my sanitizer of choice from the beginning and I am still using it because....well....I've always used it! Two points of confusion that I need to have clarified: 1. What is the recommended minimum contact time? 2. How long does the stuff maintain it's potency after it has been mixed? (for that matter, how long does the average male HBD member maintain his potency after being mixed with numerous homebrews??!??) Zum Wohl!! Randy in Salisbury, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:14:20 -0600 From: Henry Paine <hpaine at iglobal.net> Subject: alcohol bite Howdy -- I just finished my first two of batches that seem to have an alcohol bite as an aftertaste. They are too high content, I know (both 7%). My question is: Will they smooth out with time?? Thanks. Hank Paine Denton, Texas hpaine at iglobal.net Henry C. Paine, Jr. hpaine at iglobal.net Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:21:28 -0500 From: Bryan Thompson <thompsonb at mailserver.volvo.com> Subject: Low Flow Out of Boiler I use a SS keg as my boiler. The outlet is a stainless sleeve welded in about 1 inch above seam of keg bottom with sides. For many years I somehow enjoyed good flow out of a 90 deg elbow and short length of copper screen rolled up and protruding from the elbow, hugging the inside of the keg. The system worked well with leaf hops and not so good with pellets. Recently, the screen was showing its age so I tossed it and replaced it with another. Ever since, I have had very poor flow rates out of the boiler into my heat exchanger. I need to filter out the hops before my heat exchanger since it would be ruinous to my heat exchanger. I have ruled out flow problems through the exchanger. I've experimented with several other screens and geometries, but none work as well as the original which is now in a landfill - been kicking myself ever since. I was wondering how have others rigged up this part of their brew kettle? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:40:48 -0500 From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Sake Brewsters: Michael Whitt asks about sources for Sake: I made Sake. It came out good, but it was lots of work and most of my friends don't like sake and I drink it rarely, so plan on having a supply of aged sake if you are like me. My son recently partied with some of it in California and it got rave reviews. I was able to get the actual rice which had been infected with the mold which is the koji ferment used by a sake maker here in the US and also purchase real Sake polished rice in a rare set of circumstances. I have also used Japanese short grain rice for a Sake of a higher color and more similar to the Chinese rice wine. Alternatively, you can use related ferments used to produce various fermented foods in the Far East which will also do a good job so I am told. Check out your local Asian grocery store. Buy Fred Eckhardt's book "Sake" from Brewer's Publications (I think), but remember Fred is of artistic inclinations, not scientific and you will likely have to read and reread this book to really figure out what you are supposed to do. He lists contacts within the US for related stuff and you may contact him directly for more on his sporatic Sake newsletter. Wyeast sells the Sake Yeast Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Kinnelon, NJ 07405 103164.3202 at compuserve.com Dave_Burley at compuserve.com Voice e-mail OK Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:43:53 -0600 From: Mark Rogerson <arkmay at flash.net> Subject: Re: Even Mash Temp Dana H. Edgell <edgell at quantum-net.com> wrote: > 1) Old ice cream motor/MixMasher thing. .... > > 2) copper pipes. Has anyone ever tried simply inserting some thin > copper > pipes into the middle of the mash? .... Hey! That's very similar to something I dreamed up not long ago during the great MIXMASHER(TM) discussion of early 1998. Everyone point your browsers to http://www.flash.net/~arkmay/Mark/RandyStoat/tentative.gif and tell me what you think. I use the hot liquor to heat the mash, but the first thing you'll notice is that my design includes a pump. I don't know how you were planning to heat the tubing. There's no automation -- the idea is that you watch the thermometers and twist ball valves as needed (gotta get your hands dirty somehow). Like you, I wonder if the copper tubing can actually transfer heat to the mash well enough. It might be too slow for proper step mashing. If someone knows this won't work, I'd appreciate it if they told me before I build it. (But I doubt I'll build it) And now, back to the lurking ... Mark Rogerson, HMFIC Randy Stoat Femtobrewery Houston, Texas (arkmay at flash.net) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:04:02 -0600 From: "Frank Conway" <fconway at wpg.sunquest.com> Subject: More politics: Do you want to get arrested after 2 beers? George De Piro wrote: If you ignore this now, you'll pay for it later. MADD and the other neo-prohibitionists won't stop at 0.08. Zero tolerance is their goal! George, If you are responsible, this law will not be a concern. When you drink, don't drive. Here in Manitoba, the law is that you are intoxicated at a BAC of 0.05 (it used to be 0.08). If you get caught, you'll normally be asked to park your car and go home if you're close to the limit. If you're obviously intoxicated, though, you'll lose your car and license for (I think) up to six months. Also, what is the real difference between your current .1 level and .08? Not much, so why be concerned. You're right that this won't keep irresponsible idiots from getting into their cars and causing death on the roads, but if they are stopped it gives the police the powers they need to get that moron off the road. And the law causes me and not a few of my friends to get a designated driver if we know we're going to exceed the limit, or stop drinking very early if we're driving. Safer. Really. And I think that's the point. I could have gone on about how the people of the USA are paranoid about government interference in their lives, but this is a brewing forum, not a political one. So I won't. - ------ Frank Conway fconway at sunquest.com Senior Software Developer Voice: (204) 956-9771 Sunquest Information Systems FAX: (204) 957-5450 401-175 Hargrave St., Winnipeg, Manitoba Canada R3C 3R8 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:54:53 -0500 From: "Michael R. Tucker" <mtucker at frii.com> Subject: Prize Winner Hi All! Proud papa here of a bouncing baby 5 gal. batch that won a gold medal at the local Jaycees homebrew contest! Yes, the Fayetteville, NC Jaycees had their first annual home brew-off. We had about 200 people show for the festivities, and over 150 entries in 4 categories (light, medium, dark, and specialty) and three judges per category, culled from regional microbreweries and brewpubs. First ever brew contest for this area, and they did a great job. Food was provided by a couple of local sub shops, and to be honest, it was a great way to spend a Saturday afternoon. Anyway...... I entered my brew into (and won first place!!) the medium category. I must admit that I owe many thanks to ROGER GROW from Colorado for providing the base recipe that I used, and I owe many thanks to NEW BELGIUM BREWING CO. (http://www.newbelgium.com) in Colorado for providing the inspirational beer, Fat Tire Amber Ale, upon which this recipe is based. I also owe a debt of thanks to the list. I haven't contributed much, but reading the digest daily has helped me to be a better brewer, so, a collective thanks to everybody. Anyway, I was so dang proud, I had to tell somebody...... and it was you guys. :-) - --- Michael R. Tucker http://www.frii.com/~mtucker mtucker at frii.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:16:55 -0800 From: Dave Sapsis <DAVE_SAPSIS at fire.ca.gov> Subject: London bells are ringing Well, I never though it would come to pass, but maybe dream s do come true. I will have the pleasure of spending a week in London and environs at the end of next month, and would appreciate (thats pronounced ah-preece-ee-ate) any not to miss pubs or any books same. I currently know to try the White Horse, and thats bloody it. Any of you good Londoners want to meet up for a pint, that would be nice too. Private email please. cheers, - --dave sapsis Sacramento, CA, USA dave_sapsis at fire.ca.gov (bf 0% -- bummer, eh) "Lets go to the pub and have a pint to discuss the caaaaase, Lewis" - --Morse Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 10:13:42 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Re: Silicone Tubing >>>>> "Kyle" == Kyle Druey <druey at ibm.net> writes: Kyle> A few weeks ago Spencer posted some info on Silicone Tubing. Kyle> I found many suppliers, but only McMaster-Carr sells it by Kyle> the foot: Kyle> http://www.mcmaster.com/webcat/catalog.html Kyle, you da man! Thanks for finding this. I'd like to reiterate that, according to Norton, this stuff has a fairly low hot bursting strength (1.8PSI at 100C), so it is NOT suitable for pumped applications, such as RIMS. =Spencer Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 98 12:13:15 CST From: jwilkins at wss.dsccc.com (John Wilkinson) Subject: RE: Even Mash Temp Dana Edgell asked about evening mash temp. with a stirrer driven by an old ice cream freezer motor. I looked into that but the ice cream freezer motor I have turns much faster than I wanted for a stirrer. I made a stirrer using a rotisserie motor until it crapped out then used a gear motor I bought from someone in HBD. I started having stuck sparges which went away when I quit using the auto stirrer. I don't know for sure if that was all the reason for my stuck sparges but have found that I don't need that much stirring anyway. I mash in a cylindrical cooler and stir very well at mash in and maybe a couple of times after that and my results are as good as when I auto stirred but without the runoff problems. I think Jack Schmidling opined that mashing in a cooler should not need much stirring. I think he was right. If you are mashing in a pot which is directly heated, then that is another story. Auto stirring would not seem to be indicated in that case, though, as the stirring would be when heat was added in which case it should be as easy to do it manually. John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas - jwilkins at wss.dsccc.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 13:18 -0800 From: "Barry Browne" <BBrowne at golder.com> Subject: Metal Scratching Glass - NO Dan writes in HBD 2671 that he believes the metal on his carboy brush has scratched the inside of his glass carboy rendering it useless. Dan, rest easy, it is the other way around. Silica glass typically has a hardness of 7 on Moh's hardness scale as it's basically quartz (good ol'Geology at work for me there!!) and I'll bet the type of soft metal on your brush weighs in at 5 to 5.5, where 10 is diamond (hardest). What actually happened is that the glass scratched (streaked) the metal and you are seeing metal streaks on the glass. In other words you have deposited metal on the glass. I expect you'll see these streaks oxidize (turn orange/brown rust coloured) and disappear. Placing a weak bleach solution in the carboy should expedite the process. So, Brew On and be excellent to each other!! (my HBD motto as modified from Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure) Barry Atlanta, GA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 13:40:24 -0600 From: layton at sc45.dseg.ti.com (James R. Layton 972.952.3718 JLAY) Subject: hop tea haze Dan Morley reports that adding a hop tea at bottling time made his beer hazy. I tried a similar procedure a while back, except that I added the hop tea to the secondary fermenter. It did make the beer hazy, but this haze settled during the lagering stage. It took several weeks at cold temperature. Jim Layton (Howe, TX) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 14:48:00 -0500 From: bb <bbtrkpts at dns3.abcs.com> Subject: re:Legislating morality Ditto's Pat Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 14:45:31 -0500 From: jucks at cfaft4.harvard.edu (Ken Jucks, ph # 617-496-7580) Subject: apology for offensive behaviour Mr. Bill Giffen felt the need to take the Boston Wort Processors and the Boston Homebrew Competition to task on both HBD and judgenet for offending Dr. Tom O'Connor by including an inappropriate co-brewer to his entries in our list of winners for this year's contest. He is very correct that this was an offensive act. On behalf of The Boston Wort Processors, the organizers of the Boston Homebrew Competition, and myself, we are truly sorry to Dr. Tom O'Connor that he was wronged in this way. I cannot offer any suitable justification for the act and am TRULY embarrassed that this happened. One member of the club included the co-brewer upon data entry in what he thought was a practical joke. I did not know this and honestly thought that Dr. O'Connor included this himself as a joke and I mistakenly played along. Not knowing Dr. O'Connor myself, I did not realize that such a joke is not his style. I was informed of my misunderstanding by Dr. O'Connor a few weeks back and was stunned. I apologized to him at that time for my error. I am embarrassed that I did not catch the fact that this was a practical joke on the day of the competition. The offender has personally apologized to Dr. O'Connor. I am also sorry that this forum was bothered with this incident. Y'all have many more interesting topics to discuss than this. In my personal opinion (and not necessarily that of the club) this sensitive matter is best handled behind the scenes such that only the NECESSARY apology is posted here. This saves alot of bandwidth, misunderstanding, and hurt feelings. It is my hope that such an incident never happen again. On a more personal note: this whole incident leaves a very sour taste in my mouth. I am fairly new to the judging scene. I volunteered to organize this competition because I had found them to be fun, worthwhile, and educational. I worked VERY hard make the competition a success, one that our club is proud to sponsor. After having to endure this public embarassment, I will think long and hard about every helping to organize another contest, especially here in New England. With the exception of this weekend where I will judge at competition sponsored by a club that supported the BHC with lots of entries and quality judges (South Shore Brew Club), I will back off judging in our area for a while as peoples' egos are way to big for me to enjoy these competitions at the moment. Sorry again for the added bandwidth. Ken Jucks Disgraced Coordinator for the Boston Homebrew Competition Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 13:10:49 -0600 From: bob_poirier at adc.com Subject: Priming/Melanoidin Malt Let's put this priming thing to bed! Bottom line: You find something that works wonders, you use that technique for ever and ever! Good for you!! Debates as to which priming method is superior are moot - Is the beer carbonated as a result of your priming technique? Yes? BINGO!! A job well done. End of story! I submitted a comment regarding this debate, which I later regretted, because all it helped to do was to give a little more life to a topic that should have died shortly after it hatched. Let's put the damn thing out of our misery! A quickie regarding melanoidin malt: My homebrew supplier recently got a bag 'o this malt. I tasted it. I hated it! Bittersweet at first (more bitter than sweet), then, after a few seconds, it developed an EXTREMELY sharp taste. Yech! What exactly does this malt add to a brew, and will that bitter/sharp taste come through in the final product? Al K. says he uses this malt in his Munchner Dunkel. I haven't had the opportunity to sample this type of brew yet. Anyone know of an example I can try? Or, maybe a recipe?? Thanks, people!! Brew to live. Live to brew. Bob P. bob_poirier at adc.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 13:15:58 -0800 From: Ted_Manahan <tedm at hpcvn2ax.cv.hp.com> Subject: Grand Cru style? Here's a question I'm working with. I brewed a credible knock-off of Rodenbach Grand Cru. For those of you who haven't tried this classic, it's surprisingly sour and aromatic. It can be startling if the drinker isn't ready for it. So the question is - what category should I use in the AHA competition? I am leaning towards specialty. I want to be sure the judges know what to expect, and if I enter under Belgian Strong Dark they may not be informed of the specific sub style. Go our and buy a bottle, and let me know what you think. Thanks for your thoughts! Ted Manahan tedm at cv.hp.com 541/715-2856 PS - I can't resist bragging. Rodenbach Grand Cru costs about $5.00 a bottle. My home brewed version is pretty close in taste, and I have almost ten gallons of the stuff. Beer geek heaven, I tell you! Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 07:55:48 +1000 From: "David Hill" <davidh at melbpc.org.au> Subject: lager time vs temp Due to lack of multiple refrigerators I ferment my pilseners and then laager them in the one large fridge at 10C / 50F. this is obviously a higher temp that recommended for laagering. Is there a suggested time/temp relationship for lager. ie does holding at 2 months at 10C equate to one month at 2C?. In the days before brew day when there is no fermenting beer in the fridge I drop the temp until ice starts to form in the lager vessels then bring the temp back up to 10-11C to ferment the new beer. I try to drink no beer younger than 2 months. Any criticisms of this system and advice re the time/temp question? TIA DavidDavid Hill. davidh at melbpc.org.au :-)> David Hill. davidh at melbpc.org.au :-)> Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 01:49:54 GMT From: marnold at netnet.net (Matthew Arnold) Subject: Munich Dunkel I'm amazed and perplexed at the lack of Dunkel recipes floating around the 'Net. Doesn't anyone brew this fine style? If you have a good all-grain Dunkel recipe, I'd be very glad to see it. I was hoping that _Designing Great Beers_ would have a section on Dunkels. Alas, it does not. Basically, here's my current idea: Poke-Check Dark 8# Light Munich malt 1# Melanoidin malt 1# 150L Crystal .5 oz Hallertau Northern Brewer (8.5% AA) 2.5 oz Hallertau Hersbrucker (1.3% AA) Liquid lager or neutral ale yeast (depending on the time of year and my ability to lager) Single step infusion mash at ~155F (if I get brave some day, I'll try a decoction). N. Brewer and 1 oz Hersbrucker for 60 minutes, 1 oz Hersbrucker for 30 minutes, .25 Hersbrucker for 10 minutes and same at knockout. According to the recipe program I use, the O.G. should be around 1.052 (figuring a little better than 70% efficiency) and 23 IBUs (Tinseth's method). Any thoughts? Matt - ----- Webmaster, Green Bay Rackers Homebrewers' Club http://www.rackers.org info at rackers.org Return to table of contents
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