HOMEBREW Digest #2703 Sat 02 May 1998

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Quick loss of aroma (Fred Johnson)
  Subject: Care and feeding of a Gott mash/lauter tun ("Raymond Johnson")
  Re-started fermentation in the secondary ("Arnold J. Neitzke")
  Simple decoction (Ted Major)
  LUNAR RENDEZBREW 5 (michael wiley)
  What is a Stout? (Malty Dog)
  Orange flavor / Cardamom (Nathan_L_Kanous_Ii)
  Wort Nutrients / Invert Sugar / Mashing Hops (KennyEddy)
  Subject: Care and feeding of a Gott mash/lauter tun ("John Arnish")
  Northern Hydraulics Death Burner (RooJahMon)
  Refractometry (George Fix) (George J Fix)
  Two Big Brew Questions ("Jeffrey M. Kenton")
  Re: O'Doul's Amber ("Gabrielle Palmer")
  OOOPS!, Phosphine,Fusel Oil Oxidation, Chronic Disagreement ("David R. Burley")
  pH decreases with temp. ("John S. Thomas")
  RE: Getting lagers going in under 24 hours. ("Capt. Marc Battreall")
  Oxygen and the starter (ricjohnson)
  RIMS and flaked maize? (David A Bradley)
  RE: Hop Trellis (John Wilkinson)
  Stout ("David R. Burley")
  Bert Grant's IPA Question (SCHNEIDERB)
  Making a Starter... ("Lee, Ken")
  Htr Elements (David A Bradley)
  iodophore,betadine, RTD (RIMS) (Ian Smith)
  Screw-top bottles (Jeremy York)
  breathalyzers / USOpen results ("Keith Royster")
  Belgian questions (Jonathan Ingram)
  Another good reason to drink beer ("Ed Olsen / Kathy Riley")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 07:35:55 -0400 From: Fred Johnson <FLJohnson at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Quick loss of aroma I just reentered an American pale ale into a local competition that previously took 1st place in another local competition. In the first competition, the comments that came back were, "Nice hops up front.", "Nice hoppy aroma. Right on style.", and "Shouts HOPS!" from three judges, respectively. This same beer when judged six weeks later scored 10 points lower with the following comments from the two judges, respectively, "Overall aroma & bouquet very low" and "Low hop aroma". I've only been brewing for a year and a half and have never read that aroma degenerates with time (and so quickly). Would someone please explain how this could be? - -- Fred L. Johnson Apex, North Carolina Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 07:39:38 -0400 From: "Raymond Johnson" <JOHNSONR2 at state.mi.us> Subject: Subject: Care and feeding of a Gott mash/lauter tun Clean the hell out of your fermenters, and anything that touches your COOLED wort; don't worry about the mast tun. Just don't leave crud in it. If you think of it this way, you'll never ask how to clean a mash tun again. How sanitized is your grain? How many beasties are in the grain? How much residual dirt, bug carcass, etc. are in your grain? A good rinse with clean water, and a soft sponge is absolutely sufficient to clean your mash tun. Also, make sure you clean/rinse your spigot of residual wort too. I use the Gott cooler too, this is my procedure, and I've never had a problem. As you suspect, the boil kills anything that could affect the final product. It's important to remember that your beer is most susceptible while it's fermenting. Look at any homebrew book that addresses trouble shooting, and you'll notice no mention of infections that are caused by the mash. Temperature(148-155 deg. F), keeping your water level one inch above the grainbed, mashing long enough to get adequate starch conversion, and not splashing hot wort during the sparge, are your main concerns with the mash. rj Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 08:21:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Arnold J. Neitzke" <neitzkea at frc.com> Subject: Re-started fermentation in the secondary I know others have had this problem, but I have never seen the question posed of the behavior of a infected ferment? Here's the situation, I brewed a APA with the following recipe. Volume: 5.0 gallons O.G. 1.056 F.G ????? - ------------------------------------------------------------ All Grain - ------------------------------------------------------------ Grains/Fermentables Lbs Hops AAU Oz Min Pale, American 2 Row 7.75 Cascade 4.9 1.50 60 Cara-pils, American 1.00 Cascade 4.9 0.50 30 Crystal 40, American 1.00 Cascade 4.9 1.50 0 Wheat, Midwest Malt 1.00 Cascade 4.9 1.50 dry Yeast YL A02=American ale When the airlock activity stopped and the gravity checked, it showed 1.022 (this is expected with the above grain bill). I racked to a secondary with the dry hops, this was Friday the April 24th. I also noticed after about 30 minutes, that there was alot of yeast at the bottom of the fementer, almost like all the yeast settled out instantly 8-| Anyways, the next time I checked on it (April 27th) there was arilock activity of a blurp every 10 seconds! The question is, if the batch got infected, will the behavior look like a normal ferment relative to airlock activity? Or is it possible that the hops made an adjustment to the PH that favored the yeast range and they just started fermenting again? Cheers _________________________________________________________ Arnold J. Neitzke Internet Mail: neitzkea at frc.com Brighton, Mi CEO of the NightSky brewing Company - --------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 08:03:56 From: Ted Major <tidmarsh at mindspring.com> Subject: Simple decoction Tim in Lowell, Mass asks about an easy single decoction. I mash in a 5-gal Igloo cylindrical cooler with a Phil's Phalse bottom and regularly do single decoctions for German style beers, usu. Maerzens and Alts with German or Belgian malts. I mash in at 135F at about 1.3 qt/lb and immediately pull about 25% of the volume of the mash, which is about a gallon most of the time. I scoop the first quart out of the top and then use a slotted spoon to get mostly grain for the other three quarts. I heat that to 154F or so for 10-15 min and in the meantime start a couple of gallons of water boiling in case I need it to hit the right conversion temp (which I often do). After the rest at 154F, I heat to boiling for 15 min and then add back to the main mash, along with whatever boiling water I need to hit my desired conversion temp. It's a fairly easy process that only adds about 30-40 mins to my mash time, and it's interesting to see how much the grain has dakened when I add it back to the main mash. At the end of the mash, I also draw off about a gallon of the first runnings and boil them to raise to mashout temps, regardless of whether I've decocted the mash. Depending on my mood I either bring to a boil and add back to the mash or I boil for 15 mins or so for extra caramelization. I agree that a protein rest generally isn't necessary for modern malts, but a 135F hold doesn't seem to hurt my beer's body or head retention, and the color and flavor effects are worth my trouble. Cheers, Tidmarsh Major tidmarsh at mindspring.com Birmingham, Alabama "Bot we must drynk as we brew, And that is bot reson." -The Wakefield Master, Second Shepherds' Play Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 08:49:00 -0500 From: michael wiley <mwiley3 at pdq.net> Subject: LUNAR RENDEZBREW 5 Has a year passed so SOON ??????? It's Lunar Rendezbrew time again down on the beautiful shores of Seabrook, TX... The Bay Area Mashtronauts proudly annouce that Lunar Rendezbrew 5 is set for Sunday, July 19th at the Bay Area's newest Brew Pub, BOONDOGGLES !!!!!! Details will be found on the Bay Area MAshtronaut Page in the next couple of weeks... For those of you in the Greater Houston Area, we are looking for Judges and stewards. If interested, email me at the following addresses: HOME : mwiley3 at pdq.net WORK : gilbertlaw at aol.com As always, lots of Houston Area Brew Pub beer on hand, GAMES, and a great time to be had by all..... DON'T MISS OUT !!!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 09:52:56 EDT From: Malty Dog <MaltyDog at aol.com> Subject: What is a Stout? Hans E. Hansen writes, in HBD #2702: My personal preference (which carries no weight in the matter) would be for Porter to be black guzzling beer and Stout to be black sipping beer. This would harken back to the 'Stout Porter' terminology that some writers (but not all, no flames here please) suggest is the origin for Stout. That's a reasonable enough suggestion, except for the fact that by far the most popular Stout in the world, and for many people, the only one they're familiar with, is Guinness, which, on draft, is certainly a 'guzzling' (session) beer. That's a guidepost you cannot get around, when trying to decide what the style is. If Guinness is not a stout, then what is? Bill Coleman MaltyDog at aol.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 09:57:58 -0400 From: Nathan_L_Kanous_Ii at ferris.edu Subject: Orange flavor / Cardamom Recent posts have discussed the difference between Curacao orange peel (bitter) in Belgian Ales or other ways to get true orange flavor / aroma. AlK suggests that if you want real orange flavor to use an extract. No offense to Al, he knows more about brewing than I do, but I tried an orange extract for a mead and hated it. It tasted like "faux orange", just not natural. This was also mentioned WRT raspberry extracts in Stouts. Anyhow, how about Cardamom? I find it has a very citrusy, orange nose and flavor. Now, I don't believe that is the only flavor imparted either, so I would like to hear how others may describe the taste / aroma imparted by Cardomom. Nathan in Frankenmuth, MI Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 10:34:47 EDT From: KennyEddy <KennyEddy at aol.com> Subject: Wort Nutrients / Invert Sugar / Mashing Hops AlK wrote: "I have to disagree most strongly that nutrients or B vitamins would help... there are *more* than enough of these in an all-malt Barleywine." This reminds me of something I've been meaning to ask. As someone who routinely "builds" brewing water profiles from RO water plus salts, I've lately come to wonder about the need for supplemental minerals for yeast nutrition, zinc and copper in particular. I searched the HBD archives and came up with similar questions but no definitive answers. Using zinc supplement tablets was suggested, as well as reference to throwing pennies into the boiler (I do have some copper fittings in there), but only passing speculation was made as to whether a typical all-malt wort has sufficient trace copper and zinc for proper yeast nutrition. Another remedy suggested was to use yeast nutrient -- not the crysalline diammonium phosphate but the "yeast energizer" stuff. Yet another suggested tossing old dry yeast into the boil. Are there adequate traces of copper and zinc in these substances? ***** I seem to remember reading somewhere that the sugars in honey are inverted, and that honey can be used in place of invert sugar. Any comments from our inverted chemists? ***** Steve Cavan reports on adding hops to his mash: "I used 22. Target (8.3%) and 15g Challenger (8.2%) for the 90 minute mash. I had about 4kg of grain for a gravity of 1.053 in 20 liters. I also added 1 plug of Goldings (5%) for 60 minute boil At a guess I would say the final IBU level is between 35 and 40." I ran these data through SUDS using Tinseth's curves (as provided by SUDS), based on the Goldings plug being 1/2 ounce. I put the Goldings at 5% in the bill for 60 minutes and a total of 37g of 8.3% hops for 90 minutes, and reduced the 8.3% hops until the predicted IBUs was about 37. I had to reduce the 37 grams to 27 grams. Based on this back-of-envelope, one-data-point, many-uncontrolled-variables exercise (and never mind whether Steve's palate is properly IBU-calibrated), the mashed hops yielded 73% of the bitterness compared with boiling. This might at least be a fair starting point for IBU calculations for those wishing to try the method. ***** Ken Schwartz El Paso, TX KennyEddy at aol.com http://members.aol.com/kennyeddy Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 98 10:10:56 -0600 From: "John Arnish"<arnishj at smtplink.dis.anl.gov> Subject: Subject: Care and feeding of a Gott mash/lauter tun Matt: I have been using a GOTT/Rubermaid cooler for mashing, as well. I simply wash out the cooler and in my case the manifold using warm/hot water after brewing. I figure this will disolve any residual sugars that may remain along the sides or inside the manifold. The day of brewing I sanitize my cooler using iodine in lukewarm water. This way I preheat my cooler and sanitize it at the same time. Hope this helps John A Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 09:40:47 -0600 From: RooJahMon <RooJahMon at Brew-Meister.Com> Subject: Northern Hydraulics Death Burner Well, the Death burner is what I call it. I ordered the burner Harry Bush mentioned seeing in the latest Northern flyer. The burner is made of cheap cast pot-metal (China) with no assembly instructions. the first two they sent me arrived broken, and the gas jets wouldn't have lined up anyway. Through a shipping mix up, I got my burner for free, and that is the only price I would pay for it. That being said, it does work ok and is very adjustable, but again the materials and craftsmanship are a bit scary. Enter the brinkman burner. I also bought a Brinkman burner/smoker/BBQ at walmart on sale for $80. It comes with an adjustable regulator, a healthy stand and good instructions. It smokes a mean pheasant and does quick work with a batch of beer. It is a bit sooty at very low temps, but that could probably be cured with an air adjustment. Water muddy yet? Home Depot sells a burner for $40 that looks the ticket, if you don't want the smoker stuff. Haven't used one, but the price is right and it includes the regulator. If I were better compensated from 9-5 I would buy the Surperb (sp?). The square one. Curt Schroeder hauled his to the top of 14433' Mt Elbert and we boiled 2.5 gallons of water in less than 15 minutes, even with a breeze. The quality construction is worth every penny. Unless otherwise specified: RHG "Beer makes better love-handles, and love-handles make the world go around (or at least up and down)" Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 98 10:48:09 -0500 From: gjfix at utamat.uta.edu (George J Fix) Subject: Refractometry (George Fix) Note: This post is not meant to add to the (seemingly endless) gravity measurement debate, but rather to answer the specific question Harlan Bauer had about about refractometers. Therefore, Burley, Walsh, et al should put away their torches and do a Pg Dn! Refractometry has for a long time been the method of choice for gravity measurements in commercial brewing. A complete set of protocols can be found in ASBC's "Methods of Analysis", or alternatively in the abridged version "Lab Methods for Craft Brewers" that they recently published. As far as wort is concerned I have found that results from these methods can be well approximated with the simple hand held refractometers sold by Cole Palmer and others. A special feature of this method is that only a drop of solution is needed to get a gravity reading. The problem with these instruments is the one cited by George De Piro, namely alcohol interference with the gravity-refractive index relationship. Moreover, errors from this can be very large (e.g. see data below). Commercial equipment takes care of this internally by what is in effect distillation. The alcohol interference is not random, so there is some hope that correction factors can be developed for simple refractometers. The wine literature does have correction factors (references can be found e.g. in the classic book "Table Wines" by Amerling and Joslyn). However, the significant differences in fermenting (or fermented) wine must compared to beer wort leads to errors on the order of 10-15% when used for beer. Several years ago (in a consulting project was working on at the time) I came across some data that is alleged to be specific to beer. I have used these ever since in both my personal brewing as well as consulting, and find them to be within 1% of that obtained from high precision equipment. We started to include this data in our recent book, but Laurie vetoed the idea because we had no references, and she was uncomfortable with the phrase "data from unknown sources". In any case, the following are some samples. Notation: SG_R = specific gravity as measured by a refractometer ( a Cole Parmer unit) OG = original gravity of the wort before fermentation SG_A = actual specific gravity SG_R OG SG_A - --------- -------- ----------- 1.020 1.040 1.018 1.050 1.012 1.060 1.007 1.024 1.040 1.020 1.050 1.015 1.060 1.009 1.028 1.040 1.022 1.050 1.017 1.060 1.011 Observe that SG_A is essentially a linear function of OG and SG_R (a point I find somewhat troubling). Moreover, the complete data set shares this feature. However, from a practical point of view the relationships appear to be within 1% of the actual ones. Cheers. George Fix Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 10:48:19 -0500 From: "Jeffrey M. Kenton" <jkenton at iastate.edu> Subject: Two Big Brew Questions Sorry to waste bandwidth on a topic not interesting to everybody, but I will make it short... I want to avoid getting BW spooge all over my basement floor. Is there a chemical additive widely available that can knock down the huge krausen head that I have been told to expect? In lieu of that, I will try to chill a water bath and lower the temp. But I want some esters, and fusels so this will age into something smooth and tasty. Help!?! Jeff - ------------------- Jeff Kenton brewer at iastate.edu Ames, Iowa jkenton at iastate.edu (515) 294 9997 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 12:22:52 -0400 From: "Gabrielle Palmer" <gpalmer6 at ford.com> Subject: Re: O'Doul's Amber Ken Schwartz writes: > I would take exception to Marshall's comment about NA's lacking > body and hopping. I find Kaliber, Buckler, and Clausthaler to be > pretty dang tasty NA's, with a definite hop presence. While reviewing 9 NA beers (I only reviewed NA beers from European breweries) for my homebrew club's latest newsletter (see http:\\hbd.org\ford\ for more details), I came to a conclusion. NA beers either taste like watered-down versions of that brewery's regular products, or like carbonated, unfermented wort (or malta). There are a few rare exceptions to this rule. My very favorite happened to be brewed by Warsteiner and was definitely the exception to the rule. Here is the list of NA beers that I reviewed, in order of preference: 1. Warsteiner NA - Warsteiner, Germany 2. Thomas Brau NA - Paulaner, Germany 3. Buckler NA - Heineken, Holland 4. Kaliber NA - Guinness, Ireland 5. Haake Beck - Beck & Co., Germany 6. N.A. Pevo - Velke Popovice, Czech Republic 7. Clausthaler NA - Binding, Germany 8. St. Pauli NA - St. Pauli, Germany 9. Prostel Alkoholfrei - Kaiserdom, Germany - -- Cheers! Gabrielle Palmer Ford Vehicle Operations - Die Design Standards Department Cube: GB-M71 Building: Product Development Center Phone: (313)594-2107 PROFS ID: GPALMER6 Fax: (313)322-4359 internet: gpalmer6 at be0962.pd3.ford.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 12:54:24 -0400 From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: OOOPS!, Phosphine,Fusel Oil Oxidation, Chronic Disagreement Brewsters: I made a mistake in my tirade on NMR/MRI with Dean Fikar and Fred Willis pointed it out privately to me. I apologized to Dean privately for this screw-up. While my main point is correct, that nuclei do not emit radio frequency under the influence of a magnetic field, it is the relaxation of the excited nuclei to ground state which have absorbed RF supplied by the NMR spectrometer that is detected by the NMR/MRI spectrometer, not the absorption of RF energy. As I pointed out, it is the magnetic field which makes a difference in energy between the with and against the field of the nuclear spin and allows the nuclei to absorb the RF energy. However, I also said to Dean: Also, there has been a lot of fluff lately in the New Age media and in past non-scientific publications dating back to the 1800's and further about the imagined influence of magnetism on the human body and its functions. So far this has no basis in fact, just wishful thinking and in some cases on the part of shysters looking to lighten your wallet. The fact that any nuclei in any object finds an energy difference between up an down field is a fact. Does this somehow influence the functioning of the human body as this statement may imply to some? I wait to see the evidence. - ---------------------------------------------- Jorge Blasig says that he was told that grain is treated with Phosphine gas as a way of disinfecting grain. I was surprised by this statement in the absence of other information since phosphine gas at atmospheric pressure in the presence of oxygen is spontaneously flammable. This is reputed to be caused by the presence of diphosphine which is naturally present in phosphine at this pressure. It is true that phosphine gas is extremely poisonous to humans ( and I suppose other living creatures) and I suppose if it were diluted to ppm levels in nitrogen it could be used this way. In my opinion the grain would be safe to use, since phosphine ( which is the phosphorous equivalent of ammonia) is very reactive and would disappear quickly from the grain and the quantities are so small. The fact that the supplier says that the grains are fit for human consumption is the best proof that these grains can be used for brewing. - ---------------------------------------------------------- George De Piro says: > On the bright side, given enough time, the higher alcohols will > oxidize and the beer will take on a nice, aged, sherry-like character > that is appropriate (even desirable) in barley wines. This is the first time I have ever heard this as it relates to barley wines. Do you have more information on this? What is the oxygen source, particularly with carbonated wines? I always assumed it was esterification as in grape wines that was the normally active pathway to remove the fusel alcohols and provide a bouquet to the barley wines. I guess I don't understand why fusel alcohols would be preferentially oxidized before ethanol which is in substantially larger quantities. - ----------------------------------------- AlK says on the subject of invert sugar: >Just to show that I don't immediately disagree with Dave on >everything... I agree 100%. Actually we agree on by far more things than we disagree on. We both know that, it just may not look like it if you only read the HBD. - ------------------------------------------ Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Kinnelon, NJ 07405 103164.3202 at compuserve.com Dave_Burley at compuserve.com Voice e-mail OK Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 09:39:46 -0700 From: "John S. Thomas" <jthomas at iinet.com> Subject: pH decreases with temp. Al Korzonas wrote I hope you just accidentally typed that first statement backwards. As it is, pH *decreses* with higher temp. Also, your post was very close to an advertisement. Many of us have things to advertise but restrain ourselves. HBD is not the place for this. If your products are good enough, a satisfied customer will post something on your behalf. Al you are correct in both instances. pH and probe life both decrease with increasing temperatures. I wish I could say I am dyslectic but think the D word fits better. Also re-read my line and agree with you it does sound like advertising. I meant it to be informative about ideas or ratings verses cost. Thanks for catching the error Al. I will be more careful not to offend the rules the next time. John S. Thomas Hobby Beverage Equipment Jthomas at minibrew.com 909-676-2337 Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 13:05:41 -0400 From: "Capt. Marc Battreall" <batman at terranova.net> Subject: RE: Getting lagers going in under 24 hours. Jon Bovard asks in HBD2701 about how he can get his lag time reduced to less than 36 hours when brewing lagers. Jon, I too, used to have the same problem when pitching what I believed to be adequate yeast starters in my lagers. Now I can get my lagers fermenting within 4-6 hours pretty consistantly. Here is what I do as a general rule. ALL of my lager yeast starters are a minmum of 2 liters. I do not decant off any of the wort. If I start it from a slant, I step it up starting from 20 ml to 100 ml, then on to 500, 1000, 2000. I know this is alot of transferring, and the risk of contamination is increased with so many steps, but I haven't had one go bad yet. If I use a new culture pack (typically 50 ml) then I just skip the first two steps and go straight to 500, 1000, 2000. Now comes what I have discovered to be the most important part. I am sure that most other brewer's will agree. OXYGEN!!!! I ALWAYS oxygenate my wort for at least 30-45 minutes prior to pitching any yeast, lager or otherwise. I use a 100% Medical O2 setup that I get from my wife's company. Fortunately for me, she runs a medical supply and home IV infusion company and has provided me with alot of cool gear that just happens to come in pretty handy in my brewery. (Like a laminar flow hood for yeast culturing!!) I hook the tank up to a common aquarium plastic hose and aerating stone and plop it into the brewpot along with my immersion chiller and let er' rip. You could use just about any common air pump to do the same thing yourself. Just make sure that you sterlize the airflow somehow like maybe with alcohol soaked cotton or something like that. There's one other trick you could try also. I just did this with my last lager three weeks ago and I got a nice krausen head in just 4 hours, no kidding! Aerate the starter too along with the wort just prior to pitching it. I have also heard (or read somewhere) that you could pitch the starter into the wort at a slightly higher temperature, like maybe 70-80F. Chances are good that you will get a quicker start, but you might be risking both yeast shock, and off flavors in the finished beer that are undesirable in lagers. That happened to me in my early attempts at lagers. What I would recommend is to pitch at close to the temperature you are going to ferment at and make sure that the wort and yeast starter are within a few degrees of each other to prevent shocking the starter. I will also highly recommend buying and reading Greg Noonan's "New Brewing Lager Beer". (not affiliated) It may be a little techie, but I have learned a tremendous amount about lagers from it and consider it a manditory manual in your brewing library if you plan on getting serious about brewing good lager beers. Hope this helped you out. Good Luck! - -- Captain Marc Battreall Backcountry Brewhouse Islamorada, Florida Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 13:24:17 -0400 From: ricjohnson at SURRY.NET Subject: Oxygen and the starter Sorry to bring up the aeration thread again. While in a homebrew shop last week I was pondering an oxygen cannister to use in lew of aeration (shaking the carboy). The shop owner told me to just oxygenate the starter (1 quart) and not the wort (carboy). Never heard this before. Is this adequate? Richard Johnson Mount Airy, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 12:12:58 -0500 From: David A Bradley <BRADLEY_DAVID_A at lilly.com> Subject: RIMS and flaked maize? In my first test of a new false btm (Sabco) and pump system, heading towards RIMS, I brewed a "CAA" (Classic American Ale...hi Jeff!). I did a cereal mash with the flaked maize and 20 wt% pale ale malt, then combined this with the remaining malt and additional strike water. The cereal mash was: 118F(20min)->156F(50min)->boiling(40min), and the main mash equilibrated at 149F when all was added and mixed. Trying to get recirculation via my pump at low flow (<0.5gal/min I'd est), I compacted the bed. Stirred and allowed the bed to settle, the pump was started again: same result. Grain bill: 75% M&F pale ale malt, 5% M&F light xstal, 20% flaked maize. This was for a 12gal batch size. My question: anyone have experience with circulating during the mash of a similar loading of flaked maize? Dave in Indy Home of the 3-B Brewery, (v.) Ltd. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 98 12:56:09 CDT From: jwilkins at wss.dsccc.com (John Wilkinson) Subject: RE: Hop Trellis John Varady submitted his design for a hop trellis and it was clever, I thought. Made of galvanized pipe set in cement and extending up to 17 feet high he said of it: >Now you have a nice high pole to string up your hop vines. It sounds like you might have one hell of a lightning rod, too. John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas - jwilkins at wss.dsccc.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 14:36:06 -0400 From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Stout Brewsters: Matt Brooks sent me an excellent summary of the case for the name of Stout deriving from "Stout Porter". He sent this to me in response to my paraphrasing of Lewis' position that the name Stout preceded Porter. Perhaps he would care to include a copy of his comments in the HBD I said in response to his Matt's summary: Thanks for the comments on the origin of Stout Porter.I know this is a commonly used argument and pretty compelling. I was just saying that Lewis presumably having considered this readily available information also, is led to believe there was such a discontinuity( in his opinion) that Stout and Porter may have originated separately and then merged. ( or so I interpret it) He makes his argument based on the import duties, malt-paid tax ( how they taxed beer in those days) and the like. The Irish brewers were under the thumb of the British taxman and subjected to far greater indignities than their counterparts in England. Guiness used roasted barley and thus didn't have to pay tax on that portion of the grist. Lewis even quotes a letter in 1677 which reads: "We will drink to your health both in stout and best wine" Implying that as early as 1677 Stout was applied to a distinct beer. Irishman ( so says Lewis - my dictionary says English) Jonathan Swift (1667-1745) writes in a poem "Or kindly when his credit's out, Surprise him with a pint of stout". Which makes the point, I guess, that this is unlikely referring to Stout Porter, since the first known mention of Porter is later in time. Perhaps the confusion is the Irish versus the British scene. Lewis says in a chapter titled Stout Brewing in England p 22 "Although I earlier argued the case for stout preceding porter, there is clear evidence that commercial brewing of stout in England grew out of the wide popularity of Porter in London and elsewhere." He even quotes a British reference in 1805 which says: London Porter "better known as Brown Stout". This may explain the source of confusion. My American Heritage Dictionary says that "Porter - A dark beer resembling light stout, made from malt browned or charred at a high temperature. [Short for Porter's Beer]" Under Stout it says: "A strong very dark beer or ale" In My Dictionary of English (i.e. Oxford) Etymology it says: Stout :'a cant name for a strong beer', (after Dr. Johnson) strong variety of Porter. Probably ellip for S. Ale or S. Beer, the adjective being applied to a drink having good body." Note the definition of stout did not say "Stout Porter" which agrees with Lewis' position that Stout was used for any strong beer or ale, likely before Porter came to be used. I guess that solves everything. 8^) Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Kinnelon, NJ 07405 103164.3202 at compuserve.com Dave_Burley at compuserve.com Voice e-mail OK Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 15:29:32 -0500 From: SCHNEIDERB at morganco.com Subject: Bert Grant's IPA Question I am interested in brewing an IPA similar to this amazing beer and am looking for information on hops variety(ies) and hopping rate. As he states on the label it's the only propperly hopped IPA in America. My brew will be an all grain version so any information from the HBD forum is appreciated - tia - bas Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 15:33:21 -0600 From: "Lee, Ken" <KLee at resdata.com> Subject: Making a Starter... Approximatly how much DME is added per cup of water to make a 1.040 starter? I don't want to use a hydrometer (mine doesn't seem to be very accurate anyways). I usually just add about 2/3 cup DME per 2 cups of water then boil it down to around a 1 1/2 cups. I just want something a little more accurate to go by. Thanks, Kenneth Lee klee at resdata.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 12:15:56 -0500 From: David A Bradley <BRADLEY_DAVID_A at lilly.com> Subject: Htr Elements Heating elements: someone who uses the hardware store variety, can you please tell me what this element looks like after use in a copper pipe RIMS application? I seem to have lost the shiny (zinc?) coating to reveal a copper layer underneath, or the element plated out some copper from the surrounding pipe. This was just with tap water, not a batch of beer. I'm looking at buying one of the Grainger type of elements so I won't be concerned about potential leaching or dissolution of my element. Just curious. Dave in Indy Home of the 3-B Brewery, (v.) Ltd. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 16:02:10 -0700 From: Ian Smith <isrs at brew.oeonline.com> Subject: iodophore,betadine, RTD (RIMS) Does anyone know the difference (if any) between iodophore and hospital betadine? Can betadine be used as a brewing equipment sanitizer? Does anyone measure temperature (RIMS etc) with a resistive temperature device (RTD) ? I need a circuit that can convert 100 to 138 ohms (0 to 100 deg C) to 0 to 5 volts so I can read the temp with a computer. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 17:42:33 -0700 From: Jeremy York <jeremy at ThemeMedia.com> Subject: Screw-top bottles I've been making meads and cysers for some time now, and have just recently gotten into brewing beers (partially for quick gratification, partially because I want to learn to do Barley Wine and Braggots). I've usually used champagne bottles and 22 oz beer bottles, but now find myself needing to bottle in 12 oz bottles as well. Now, I have some vague recollection that one shouldn't use bottles with the exterior threading that allows for "twist-off" caps in home brewing. Am I imagining things, or are these bottles better put in the recycling bin? I must say, I've learned a heck of a lot since starting to brew beers, and I'm excited because I think it will improve my mead and cider making tremendously. Just having more books and so on, and more modern things to refer to, has helped a lot. Also, I used to think that there wasn't any need for me to homebrew beer; afterall, in the land of microbrews, there's a vast assortment of quality beers to try, right? They're going to do it better than I could anyway, right? Having made the plunge, that line of thinking went up in a puff of smoke. For example, I'm eagerly anticipating the end of summer (before it even starts) so that I can try my hand at making some traditional Scottish and Scotch Ales. I've been enjoying my first flawed attempt at it far more than Grant's dubiously named Scottish Ale. - -- Jeremy York Projectionist "Immersed, I explore. ThemeMedia Inc. VOX 425 602-3557 Text, not read, is understood. jeremy at ThemeMedia.com FAX 425 602-3570 Words into wisdom." vmail 425 298-5933 http://thememedia.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 21:21:28 +0500 From: "Keith Royster" <keith at ays.net> Subject: breathalyzers / USOpen results Kevin TenBrink <tenbrink at jps.net> says on the subject of breathalyzers- > There is some residual air that remains > in the lungs and the trachea, this is called the tidal volume if my memory > serves me correctly. This tidal volume is where the alcohol traces are > collected that the breathalyzer is meant to measure. A sure fire way to > remove the traces of alcohol from the sample is to replace or dilute this > tidal volume with fresh air...to do this simply take several very deep > inhales followed by a very forceful exhale, trying to force every last bit > of air from your lungs....doing this in rapid succession will reduce the > measurable amount of alcohol in your breathalyzer sample. Sure, but I'd be so dizzy from repeated deep exhales that I would probably fail because I couldn't walk a straight line =) Speaking of ways to "beat" the system, I vaguely remember hearing that either eucalyptus or menthalatum (as in cough drops) can throw these beathalyzers off. (sorry if this has been discussed and I missed it.) Anybody able to comment on the validity of this? Also, the results of the USOpen homebrew competition can be found at our web site, http://www.ays.net/brewmasters/. Keith Royster - Mooresville/Charlotte, North Carolina email: keith at ays.net http://www.ays.net/brewmasters -Carolina BrewMasters club page http://www.ays.net/RIMS -My RIMS (rated COOL! by the Brewery) http://www.ays.net/movingbrews -pumps and accessories for advanced homebrewers Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 20:02:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Ingram <jonathaningram at yahoo.com> Subject: Belgian questions I was wondering if anyone knew anything about a Belgian called Liefeman's Goudenband. I just tried it and liked it a lot. I am familiar with the name Liefeman's I am really trying to find out what Goudenband is, style, etc. My friends also just bought me a bottle of Chimay Cinq Cent for my birthday; from my experience with French this translates to Five Hundred, I was just trying to figure out what the correlation was, and if anyone had a recipe for brewing something similar ( not a grain recipe, I haven't gotten that far yet). Thanks, Jon == Jonathan Ingram We Are Penn State! JonathanIngram at yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free at yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 20:41:16 -0700 From: "Ed Olsen / Kathy Riley" <olsen-riley at worldfront.com> Subject: Another good reason to drink beer With all due credit to my friend, Tim Mcoy: A herd of buffalo can move only as fast as the slowest buffalo. When the herd is hunted, it is the slowest and weakest ones at the back that are killed first. This natural selection is good for the herd as a whole, because the general speed and health of the whole group keeps improving by the regular culling of the weakest members. In much the same way the human brain can only operate as fast as the slowest brain cells. Excessive intake of alcohol, we all know, kills brain cells, but naturally it attacks the slowest and weakest brain cells first. In this way regular consumption of beer eliminates the weaker brain cells, making the brain a faster and more efficient machine. That's why you always feel smarter after a few beers. Ed Olsen / Kathy Riley olsen-riley at worldfront.com Return to table of contents
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