HOMEBREW Digest #2792 Sun 09 August 1998

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Fizzy barleywine, Sulfite,Clinitest,Carrageenan ("David R. Burley")
  transfering wort to the fermenter (Ryan Jay McCammon)
  summary of sparge water acidification techniques (Jeff Pharr)
  Wit's end; the female palate (Keith Busby)
  re: oak in IPA ("phil grossblatt")
  Infected Primary ("Buchanan, Robert")
  RE: Help, low carbonation (Jeremy Price)
  Propane BOOM; using oak; sulfites; wheat beer; oaky yeast; snapping necks (Samuel Mize)
  Honey in beer (Rod Wellman)
  Naked Pueblo Homebrew Comp (NA Campiglia)
  cheap shots/yeast data (BPis4U2NV)
  NaOH and Glass Carboys (Bob.Sutton)
  Low-tech starter method (Nathan Kanous)
  Overpitching (Al Korzonas)
  holes in my fridge (Al Korzonas)
  Wyeast 2007 (Al Korzonas)
  Oak in brewing (feldman)
  Historical Brewing Article for review (Badger Roullett)
  Oak Casks and Flavor... (Badger Roullett)
  Carbonating in a keg & CAP (help) (keith  christiann)
  Women and Beer (Badger Roullett)
  Women and beer (Al Korzonas)
  List of Dried Yeasts? (Badger Roullett)
  Clinitest (Al Korzonas)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 09:37:59 -0400 From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Fizzy barleywine, Sulfite,Clinitest,Carrageenan Brewsters: John Penn asks what to do with his non-fizzy barley wine. Before you bottled it, you should have bottled it with an active kraeusening starter which had some FAN from added malt extract, as I have recommended in the past. Now I suggest you take a sample of yeast and start it before you add it back to the barleywine. You may even wish to make a small starter and gradually feed it a bottle of your wine to condition it. Also you can try the addition of yeast nutrients ( about 5-10% of normal dosage) and/or a tablespoon of boiled malt extract. An alternative procedure is to use an S. Bayanus yeast ( typically a champagne yeast) which will be happy to ferment the remaining sugar and carbonate the wine. I would start it in a small amount of 1.0200 malt extract and then be sure it will ferment in your barleywine by adding a bottle. This can be used to be added to each bottle from which a small amount of wine has been removed. - ------------------------------- Alan Keith Meeker makes a fine presentation on the sensitivity of some persons to excessive sulfites. I know only too well that excessive sulfite can be dangerous to some people, as I remember my asthmatic daughter developed severe breathing problems as a young woman after eating at a sulfite treated salad bar. However, my point was, I know of no problems with the low levels of sulfites in commercial wines. Interestingly most people complain of these headaches with red wine but can drink white wine just fine. When bottled, white wine often contains 3 or 4 times as much sulfite as red wine. I suspect "red wine gives me a headache" is part of the food additive hysteria that has been fomented in this country by the "health" industry, saying don't try their additive - try mine! - ---------------------------------------------- Joe Rolfe says: "Granted I never used Clinitest, and it would be a nice extra data point to stack next to the fast ferment data I had." Enough said. I can guarantee that if you ran a Clinitest you would realize it only takes 5 DROPS of beer to run and is finished in 1 minute and measures EXACTLY what you want to know "Is the beer done yet?" independently of any other measurement. No muss, no fuss and no doubt. A forced fermentation or even a simple hydrometer measurement requires 100 ml or more of beer each time you measure it. AND you are not measuring what you want to know, since you need at least three measurements in a row to know "for sure". This method can require up to 500 mls of beer or perhaps even more if you have a slow ferment. Not much on a commercial scale, but a lot to a homebrewer. With Barleywine, this represents an even bigger percentage, since it is often slow to finish. Your description of all of the many parameters you have measured on over three hundred batches exhausts me just reading it. I admire your stamina, but the majority of that work was not necessary IMHO. The point is you do not need to know "how low will it go?" for each individual yeast and mash and then admit that the fast ferment goes lower than main batch, anyway. Clinitest is definitive about the endpoint of the fermentation in each batch, regardless. Clinitest KIts cost less than $20 at your Pharmacy, last I looked, and is good for 30 or so tests and a set of 100 tablets ( one for each test) is only a few dollars. This is a heck of a lot less than a breakable $80, more accurate hydrometer ( which still doesn't measure what you want to know and requires a lot more beer). Please try the Clinitest and then give us your opinion. - ----------------------------- Many (15 to 20?) years ago I experimented with SeaGel ( I think) from FMC and a number of the other carrageenans they offered for making candies and other foods gelled. I always ended up with cloudy beer. Since I didn't have any guidelines on how much to use it may have been excessive, I don't know. But I know there were different molecular weights available, probably a by-product of the extraction process. I think one of the advantages of the Irish Moss, perhaps is the higher molecular weight Carrageenan stays in the moss particles and clears the wort by settling quickly. - ------------------------------ Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Kinnelon, NJ 07405 103164.3202 at compuserve.com Dave_Burley at compuserve.com Voice e-mail OK Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 09:50:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Ryan Jay McCammon <mccammon at umich.edu> Subject: transfering wort to the fermenter Greetings. I have been lurking for a couple of months now and have learned a great deal. I brewed my second batch ever last night, and hope that it will be significantly better than the first, which has a strong metallic odor and taste (I'd be happy to give it to any of you Ann Arborites for diagnosis as it would help me learn some things and get rid of the lousy stuff). I think last night's batch will be better primarily because of the use of my new homemade immersion chiller and b/c I used liquid yeast stepped up twice in a starter culture. I all (both) of my batches, I had a fair bit of difficulty transfering the wort from the boiling pot to the fermenter because of the residual from the hop pellets. The first time, I just tossed the pellets into the wort, and when it came time to transfer, they immediately clogged the filter on my funnel (which I think is way too fine anyway). So this time, I put the pellets in a nylon 'hop boiling bag' that the homebrew shop sold me - apparently this is for whole hops, as by the end of the boil the bag was empty and there was a fine green sediment in the wort. I started out racking from the pot to the funnel (stuck in the mouth of the carboy) with a choreboy pad around the end of the cane and the filtering screen in the funnel. The siphon was very slow, and the screen in the funnel immediately clogged, so I decided just to siphon directly into the carboy w/o the funnel, hoping that the hops and any break material would settle out in the fermenter. Will they? How do I get the wort into the fermenter while leaving the hops and so on behind? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 10:14:14 -0400 From: Jeff Pharr <pharr at metsci.com> Subject: summary of sparge water acidification techniques In HBD #2788 I asked what additives others were using to drop the pH of their sparge water to the required 5.5 to 6.5 range. I received no fewer than 14 responses so I thought I would take a minute to summarize: Most folks pointed out that my attempt to use gypsum to reduce the mash pH was doomed from the start. It works in the mash because it is able to free H+ ions into solution thereby reducing the pH. The raw materials for the H+ producing chemical reaction are not available in the sparge water so the gypsum additions don't do much more than make the water cloudy. To achieve the needed drop in pH another form of acid must be added. The following is a list, in order of popularity, of the acids used by the responding brewers: lactic phosphoric citric malic tartaric winemaker's acid blend (probably a combination of several of the above) The most unique suggestion was to start with RO or distilled water and use DME at the rate of about 1 tablespoon per gallon. Tangible benefits of sparge water acidification were claimed by only about half of the respondents. It was noted that using overly basic sparge water can result in leeching astringent compounds from the mash. There was also a warning that over-acidification of the mash can result in reduced hot-break formation. No one offered me reduced prices on bulk purchases of gypsum. Thanks to all who responded! I will be brewing this weekend and trying one of your suggestions. - --Jeff Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 09:35:09 -0500 From: Keith Busby <kbusby at ou.edu> Subject: Wit's end; the female palate Paul is confusing different styles of wheat beers. The Blue Moon approximates to the Belgian Wit and ought to taste slightly tart and have an aroma of curacao peel and coriander, added late. The cloves and bananas he is looking for are characteristic of German Weizens or Hefeweizens (and come from the Weihenstephan yeast). American wheats may have none of those characteristics. Hoegaarden suggest you pour most of the beer, then shake up the remaining inch or so and than add that; Germans usually ask if you want it "mit Hefe" or "ohne Hefe", but the sediment is to my taste part of the mouth-feel of a Hefeweizen. Surely he can find Celis or Hoegaarden in sophisticated New England. Even we Okies can get the latter (Celis in Texas does not regard neighbouring Oklahoma as sufficiently sophisticated to be worth exporting to). I more or less agree with Monica about there being no apparent reason why women should not like beer. My wife loves it, and I have always thought that women who said "I don't like beer" just needed to be educated (just like I thought I didn't like cheese before I went to France). On the other hand (and as we scholars say, I don't have the reference to hand), I read somewhere recently that there was some evidence to suggest that the female palate sometimes responded differently to the male. Keith Busby Keith Busby George Lynn Cross Research Professor University of Oklahoma Center for Medieval and Renaissance Studies 780 Van Vleet Oval, Room 202 Norman, OK 73019 Tel.: (405) 325-5088 Fax: (405) 325-0103 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 09:05:36 -0600 From: "phil grossblatt" <philgro at swcp.com> Subject: re: oak in IPA Al K wrote: > they used European oak as opposed to American oak (which is far more > "oaky") to make the casks... there are a number of old English brewing books > that specifically say to NOT use American Oak for casks because it *imparts > a flavour* to the beer, >From what I've read,and my own knowledge of oak in wine making,I believe you might have meant to say "English oak" not "European oak". French ,Hungarian and many other oaks from "Europe" are definitely very "oaky",although American oak is often considered more assertive.The preparation of the wood itself is as significant as the origin. A BT article suggests that British casks were made from harder oak,which would impart less flavor. I believe your point about lining casks with pitch makes the above moot anyway... Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:05:02 -0400 From: "Buchanan, Robert" <RBuchanan at ChristianaCare.org> Subject: Infected Primary Kris Jacobs posts in HBD#2788 about his snotty,slimy batch. Me thinks thou hast discovered that nasty botulism organism. (humor) ;-) Sorry to hear it Kris. Please let's not start that silly botulism thread again. Bob Buchanan "There are TWO rules for success in Life: Rule 1: Don't tell people everything you know." Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:32:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Jeremy Price <pricejy at email.uc.edu> Subject: RE: Help, low carbonation >John Penn asks about carbonation problems with high gravity Barley wines I have found that in order to get proper carbonation with extremely high gravity beers is to add fresh yeast along with corn sugar at botteling time. I make a about a 1/2 quart starter with the same yeast as I used for the primary fermentation, allow the starter to reach high krausen, and pitch along with 2/3 cup corn sugar (boiled of course.) Jeremy Price p.s. On an unrelated note, would people start calling wyeast by their names! They do have Names! I have no Idea what wyeast # 2260 is without searching for a used wyeast pouch. thanks, #2250124 (oh, I mean Jeremy) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:22:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Samuel Mize <smize at mail.imagin.net> Subject: Propane BOOM; using oak; sulfites; wheat beer; oaky yeast; snapping necks On the radio news today, a house in Fort Worth TX was levelled and six people injured by a propane explosion (maybe natural gas, they said both). Not a reason to avoid using such gases, every form of energy has risks. But you Cajun Cooker folks, let's be careful out there. - - - - - - - - - - Alan Meeker asked about using oak. In 1997, Dave Burley suggested "around 4 ounces/5 gallons for a subtle taste in one of your big hoppy nosed IPA's." Al K said that "4 ounces of American oak chips in 5 gallons of beer is going to give you a *lot* of oak flavour." Mark Bayer said that with 2 ounces of american oak chips in 5 gallons for a 2-week secondary, "the final product tasted like plywood that had had a little beer spilled on it." Have fun messing with it. If you overshoot, you can always make an un-oaked batch and blend. Dave says to sterilize (yep) the chips, perferably to "pressure cook for 10 minutes at 15 lbs," failing that "boil for 20 minutes in water and use the water as well as the chips," since some flavoring agents boil out. - - - - - - - - - - Alan Meeker wrote about sulfites, quoting Dave Burley: >>As far as "natural" goes, remember that some wine yeast make sulfite. >>Sulfite in the form of sulfur candles has been used in making wine >>for more than two millenia by Greek, Roman and French vintners. > >The Romans also used to put lead into their wine... Not intentionally... You kind of dodged his point. Sulfite is as "all-natural" as salt. That doesn't make it safe, just natural. Some people care. >>I see people are often concerned by the "contains sulfites" label on wine >>bottles from France. I think this marketing ploy ... by nitrogen-using, >>large US vintners has gone far enough. ... >I don't think this is just a marketing ploy. I don't either -- it's not JUST marketing. However, it would be refreshing to see companies refusing to pander to irrational fears just to make a buck. You're sure A-B doesn't make wine? [ :-) smiley, joke, just opinion, don't sue, why SURE old beer is skunky ] Some people think things are dangerous if processed, and safe if "natural" - -- you know, like curare, blowfish toxin, or uncooked tapioca... These rubes fear sulfites, whether or not they're sensitive to them. Just yesterday I saw a web page saying that pasteurized milk has been "killed" and so has no real value -- only "living" food is nutritious -- AND it's on the WEB, so it MUST be TRUE... Really though, it IS critical for a person who's sensitive to a chemical (or a plant) to know if the problem item is in their food. My wife is allergic to (all-natural) mesquite. I always carry antihistamines just in case she forgot hers, because a lot of restaurants in Texas use mesquite for flavoring without telling you. >There are a whole class of verified sensitivities to food additives ... >with catchy names ... (the names are uncharacteristicly humorous ... in >respected journals such as Lancet...) They're just poking a little fun... with a lancet... never mind... Getting back to home brewing: Dick's first description of making perry said that you don't even need to add yeast. Later, when he thought Dave had suggested a killing dose of sulfite, he said: >If you do sulfite the juice, you need to wait about a >day and then inoculate it with a yeast starter, since the sulfite is >pretty good at killing off the natural yeast you might otherwise use. This hardly says (to me) that the naturally-occurring yeast are better, just that they'll be dead (perhaps not true, at the dosage Dave suggested). - - - - - - - - - - Paul Ward <paulw at doc.state.vt.us> says: > I'm not even sure which type of knife it is socially acceptable to eat > my peas with. Use that short flat one. The butter helps stop them rolling off. And goes on about wheat beers: > Sam Adams, Pete's, Long Trail, Breckenridge ... I have > NEVER noticed any bananas or cloves in any of them, although I've > looked for those flavors. I believe those are "American wheat" beers. They WON'T have the flavors that comes in German-style weizen beers. They're very different, the American style is mostly defined by what it doesn't have. And another thing, why do we stick "American" onto a style when we mean "lame?" Not all American styles are lame. American-style Barleywine, American Brown Ale, American Pale Ale, these are great, American-created styles. But American Lager and American-Style Wheat are just lame versions of the original, flavorful styles. Read the style guides: any flavor or aroma is a fault. "Malt sweetness is absent. ... Hop aroma is absent. Hop bitterness is slight, and hop flavor is mild or negligible." Everclear in water nails it. American Wheat is allowed a touch of fruity esters "at low levels," whoopee, "however, phenolic, clovelike characteristics should not be perceived." These are categories for mega-brewed lite swill. Well, other countries mega-brew lite swill too, and I'm tired of hearing it called "American" just because we have efficient industrial production and distribution. Mega-brewers want one centrally-produced, centrally-mandated beer for all. This isn't an American ideal, it's socialist. The French aren't known for great beer, they're a WINE country, and they're pretty socialist. Let's call them FRENCH Lager and FRENCH Wheat. Write your Congressman. I'm sure that Michael Jackson, being English, will approve. >After all this, my question is - "was I supposed to shake the yeast >back into suspension, or decant off the yeast in the bottom of the >bottle?" Yes. People do both. Try it both ways and see what you like. - - - - - - - - - - Al describes getting oak character from yeast, and says: > ... I have tasted Jim Liddil's excellent > AHA National Competition Best of Show pGueuze and it had an oaky aroma, > despite being fermented in *plastic*. Al or Jim, have you identified which organism threw that aroma? Any special handling to emphasize it? (No data in 1997-98 HBDs.) Alan asked about using oak because he likes it in wine, and Al responded with 58 lines about how IPAs don't require oak. I guess Alan did ask for "any advice and any experiences [we]'d care to relate." Glad you got that off your chest, Al. - - - - - - - - - - Frederick J. Wills says: > Let's try and put this brewing myth (my opinion) to rest for once. ... > Has anyone ever had a carboy neck snap off on them? You mean anyone still living? :-) Mostly they slip, either being poorly seated or made for a different-size carboy. I expect you're right about the neck snapping, nobody holds a full carboy out horizontal by the neck. (This is NOT a dare. You over there, put that down.) Best, Sam Mize - -- Samuel Mize -- smize at imagin.net (home email) -- Team Ada Fight Spam: see http://www.cauce.org/ \\\ Smert Spamonam Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 11:57:31 -0500 From: Rod Wellman <rmw at williams.com> Subject: Honey in beer Greetings! A homebrewer for almost 2 years now, I just recently joined the list. Already I can tell this will be a great learning tool! I work for an advertising agency which handles materials for one of the large honey producers. I was excited when I was assigned the task of writing a section for their web site which discusses the use of honey in beer...from large scale national brews, to microbrews, to homebrews. It will be an educational section simply to inform people of the fact that honey is used in various beers. I have been looking for information regarding the history of honey in beer and also things like what characteristics honey adds to a wheat beer, an ale, a porter (other styles, too), how much is generally used, what types of honey are used and why...etc. (I'm not at this point going to include much on mead, as that will probably be addressed on its own in the future). Has anyone on this list contributed such information before (which they could re-post, or send to me directly)? I also plan on contacting some brewmasters at microbreweries, brew-pubs...maybe even at Michelob, to glean some information from them. Also, maybe some information exists in the form of a magazine article in BYO or Zymurgy...or in various books on brewing. I am looking into all of these things, but any shortcuts that can be provided from this list will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! BTW: I just brewed a Honey Porter in March that, IMHO turned out fabulous. If anyone wants the recipe (extract) I'd be happy to provide it. It has a subtle, yet pronounced honey flavor, and has a good hop balance and excellent body. Rod Wellman Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 11:56:31 -0500 From: NA Campiglia <spitdrvr at camalott.com> Subject: Naked Pueblo Homebrew Comp Anyone have any info on this competition??? Please let me know, Id like to enter NA Campiglia III Abilene, TX http://camalott.com/~spitdrvr '67 MkIII, '74 1500, '76 1500 Triumphs and Homebrew, what else could you want? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 13:20:35 EDT From: BPis4U2NV at aol.com Subject: cheap shots/yeast data '(Even Fouch could figure it out)"???!? HEY! No fair taking cheap shots at a guy while he's on vacation! Cease and desist! And after I figure out what Druey was talking about, I'll respond in full..... Any way, on to the body of my post: A data point to add to Goerge DP's comments on yeast attenuation.... I did a little quick and dirty experiment- I brewed an ESB type 5 gallon batch from all grain, and hopped it with 2 ounces NB (1 oz. bittering, 1 oz. flavor) and split it into five different gallon jugs. each was innoculated with a different yeast strain, the five I use most often. flavor comments will follow, as the beers are only about a week in the bottle, but an observation on the attenuation: All but one yeast finished at the same gravity. OG 1.050 Yeast FG Widmere Hefe. yeast 1.015 (A German Alt) Bell's Amber Strain 1.020 Belgian Strong Ale 1.015 Belgian Trappist 1.015 Belgian Wheat 1.015 All were fermented in the same Son-of-a-Fermentation box at the same temp. I'll post a follow up when I have done some tasting, and have my beer notes in hand. (Kyle- I can explain this to you later.) Eric Fouch Bent Dick YoctoBrewery On brewing Hiatus in Traverse City, having commandeered the stepson's AOL account. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 13:01:22 -0400 From: Bob.Sutton at fluordaniel.com Subject: NaOH and Glass Carboys Jeremy Bergsman stated: >I have largely given up on TSP in favor of NaOH ("lye" or "caustic"). >While potentially a little more dangerous than TSP it seems to me that >the hazards are similar in nature and magnitude and it is cheaper and >easier on the environment (as far as I know anyway). Does TSP offer >any cleaning power other than the high pH? I don't know what concentration you're working at, but NaOH can etch glass (ever notice how the heavy-duty toilet cleansers are typically HCl-based), providing all sorts of nooks and crannies for the scumdoochies to hang out. I don't have my corrosion data handy, but if you limit your concentration to 0.2N, and operate at "ambient" conditions, and you should have negligible etching and achieve a cleansing and sanitization action - though I can't comment on the anti-microbial effectivity of 0.2N NaOH versus iodophor. Bob Fruit Fly Brewhaus Yesterdays' Technology Today Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 13:03:46 -0500 From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu> Subject: Low-tech starter method Hello. I've been following the starter thread and will choose to direct the discussion somewhere else. Let's say that I believe a HUGE health starter is a great start to wonderful beer. I hear people talk about "2L starters" and other volumes. I also hear people recommend using stir plates, constant aeration with an aquarium stone, and even an oscilating whatever. It seems that to maximize growth to create the largest population of yeast from a given starter that some form of "constant" oxygenation is beneficial (i.e. stirring, or air pump, or agitation). Now, what if I don't have a stir plate, oscilator, or aquarium pump and don't want to make a 5 gallon starter (please note insertion of slight sarcasm). Could you effectively increase the yeast growth by increasing the exposed surface area of the starter? IOW, if you use the same starter volume (without any "constant" aeration or agitation) could you expect a larger yeast population by spreading the starter very thin, as opposed to deep? It would be easier for me to get a large shallow piece of tupperware or something, as opposed to buying / fabricating more gadgets if I could expect some improvement over current methods (i.e 1L and 2L erlenmyers). I hope this makes sense. nathan Nathan L. Kanous II, Pharm.D., BCPS Clinical Assistant Professor School of Pharmacy University of Wisconsin - Madison Office Phone (608) 263-1779 Pager (608) 265-7000 #2246 (digital) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 13:13:30 -0500 (CDT) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Overpitching Paul asks if overpitching may be a myth. First, let me point out that since most homebrewers underpitch, the likelyhood of overpitching is quite remote. I'll bet you can pitch 5 or 10 times what the average homebrewer pitches and still not be overpitching. In the past, sevearl HB authors have suggested that overpitching can lead to autolysis... I believe that Noonan is one of them. Since he didn't give a reference or a plausable reason, I will remain skeptical. Therefore, I can only guess at the reasons that overpitching might be bad for your beer, but I'll just toss it out for discussion and see what we can come up with as a collective. I speculate that if you pitch too many cells into your wort: 1. The limited amount of oxygen you can dissolve in your wort is shared by a larger number of cells, so that each yeast cell gets less oxygen than if you had pitched "the proper amount." Less oxygen means less alcohol tolerance because of weak cell membranes. I should point out, however, that prior to dehydration, yeast destined to be dry yeast are aerated very well. Dry yeast not only outnumbers liquid yeast when it comes to pitching without stepping-up, but also the yeast comes ready for work. 2. The yeast population is relatively old in any starter and therefore since there are more cells and a limited amount of nutrients and oxygen to go around, the yeast cannot multiply as much as if there were fewer of them sharing the resources. Less growth in an already aging population means an even more aged population by the end of fermentation. Personally, after critically tasting well over 1500 homebrewed and more than 2000 different commercial beers, I can only recall two beers that were noticeably rubbery, clearly indicating autolysis. I believe that either my threshold for the aromas and flavours of autolysis is very high or that the risk of autolysis is (forgive me)... overpitched. Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 13:22:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: holes in my fridge Steve writes: > When I say I drilled the hole, I really used a hole saw on a drill to >accomplish it. I drilled from the inside, cut through the inside layer and >then stopped. The side of the refrigerator had fiberglass insulation, so I >was able to kind of push the insulation aside (watch out for the sharp >edges!) and peer into the refrigerator wall to see if there were any >refrigeration lines in the way. As it happened, it was clear, so I finished >it up. The insulation you bring up is very important to the efficient running of the fridge. I've read where you want to make sure that you seal up the outside and inside holes (perhaps with silcone tub caulk?) so that moisture cannot: 1. get into the inside of the fridge (leading to mould), and 2. condense on the *outside* of the *inner* wall, wetting the insulation and therefore making the fridge very inefficient. Hey, Tuttle: We know the inside shell is supposed to be moisture-proof, but is there a vapour barrier seal on the *outside* shell of most fridges? Is the aforementioned a valid concern? Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 13:29:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Wyeast 2007 Jeff writes: >2007 is reputedly Anheuser/Busch and very >neutral. That's OK, but maybe you'll want a little more character. Check your sensitivity to acetaldehyde, Jeff. Both Wyeast #2007 and the A-B Budweiser yeasts are strong acetaldehyde producers and tend to leave a *lot* of it in the finished beer. Acetaldehyde, for those who aren't familiar, lends a green apple aroma/flavour to the beer. Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 14:36:09 -0400 From: feldman at lexmark.com Subject: Oak in brewing Alan writes wanting commercial examples of "oaked beers". Well, I had never had a beer with any type of oak character, but I just tried Portland Brewing's IPA Seasonal. It is an "oaked beer", and in my opinion it is also a good beer. You can taste the oak flavor, but it is not overwhelming and there are plenty of hops in there also. I recommend you try it. It should be relatively easy to find. On a related note (concerning Al's post) the beer says on it's label something to the effect that in the 1800's the British came up with the IPA style which was characterized by hop flavor and rich oak character. Any comments Al? Have you tried this one? Would this be an example of your proposed American IPA? Is that the American Oak taste? If it is I LIKE IT!!!!! Bobby Feldman BOCK Member Brewers of Central Kentucky Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:43:19 -0700 From: Badger Roullett <branderr at microsoft.com> Subject: Historical Brewing Article for review I recently entered an SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism, if you don't know what that is go to http://www.sca.org/sca-intro.html for an explanation.) Arts and Sciences competition with a Honey Chamomile Amber Ale. i produced in the way of documentation an article on the production of the above recipe, and its relation to Period ingredients and methods. I posted this article to the web, and you can find it on my brewing page at http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/beer/honeycham.html. My question is this... Should i submit this, or something similar to magazines like Brewing Techniques or BYO? is it, or other articles like it, something you would wish to read in magazines? i produce articles for our local newsletters (SCA) all the time, and was wondering if maybe i could branch off into modern magazines as well. Feedback is appreciated. ********************************************* Brander Roullett aka Badger Brewing Page: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/badgbeer.html Badgers Brewing Bookstore: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/brewbook.html In the SCA: Lord Frederic Badger of Amberhaven, Innkeeper of the Cat and Cup Inn Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:56:06 -0700 From: Badger Roullett <branderr at microsoft.com> Subject: Oak Casks and Flavor... From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Oak in brewing "1. they used European oak as opposed to American oak (which is far more "oaky") to make the casks... there are a number of old English brewing books that specifically say to NOT use American Oak for casks because it *imparts a flavour* to the beer Ok Al, and all you Beer Brained Buckaroos out there.... Oak Casks.. how does one tell American and Euro Oak? how can you age a beer in a SMALL (5 gallon) cask with out adding too much flavor? Why? As a historical recreationist, and a brewer, i want to try my hand at casking a batch. the Coolness Factor of showing up at an event with a 5 gallon cask is immesurable, and its period to boot. My plan is to buy a cask from local brewing store (Evergreen, or the Cellar) for around $100 (ouch!! anyone know of cheaper?) and brew a 10 gallon batch, and SS Keg 5 gallons, and Oak Cask the other 5 gallons. Force carb one, and natural the other, and compare them for taste and flavor. I also wish to enter the cask in a Baronial (sca stuff again) Arts and Sciences Competition so any pointers to Cask brewing articles on the net, or books would be appreciated.. any one done any similar research they can share? Badger ********************************************* Brander Roullett aka Badger Brewing Page: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/badgbeer.html Badgers Brewing Bookstore: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/brewbook.html In the SCA: Lord Frederic Badger of Amberhaven, Innkeeper of the Cat and Cup Inn Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 12:01:58 -0700 (PDT) From: keith christiann <kchris1 at lausd.k12.ca.us> Subject: Carbonating in a keg & CAP (help) Brew Brothers, Carbonating kegs: I like to carbonate my kegs by force carbonating through the liquid out connection. The gas bubbles up the dip tube and seems to carbonate quicker. What makes this process so easy is that I use flare fittings. This makes it quick/easy to interchange fittings. When cold, gassing/rocking for a few minutes does the trick! I'll time it next time (4 minutes sounds about right for me). *** Jeff Renner kindly responds to my CAP questions below (please bare with the way I snip and reply. It is easiest for me). *** >I would like to brew a batch of CAP in honor of my child that will be here >soon. My kids are gone a lot, too. ;-) I can't wait for mine to arrive! He or she will be learning to read thermometers, pH papers, and scales at an early age guaranteed ;-). *** >For a 10 gallon batch, I am considering the following recipe/procedure: > >15 lb. American 6 Row (will I need to adjust the gap on my Malt Mill?) >4 lb. Flaked Maize Sounds good. I find that a double pass on the standard MM gap works well for 6-row What is the standard gap. I just started to play with the adjustments and I don't know where it was initially. I think I remember JS posting that it was near .045? I also remember Dave B. and others got good results from making the first pass at .08 and the second for .06, but that may have been for 2-row and not 6-row? *** If you're up to step mashing, I'd mash in at 40C (104F) and just pass through 50C on the way to 60C with no rest. That's what I do with good results. Of course, I can ramp at about 1 degree C/minute with my bottom fired RIMS. (Gee, I hope your text reader can handle these abbreviations and acronyms). Also, I'm beginning to think that a 70C (158F) rest, while historically correct, in my system results in a less attenuated, less crisp beer than I'd like. Yes, I am up to step mashing. I have a gas fired stove and an EM installed in my mash tun. I do need to purchase a pump to keep temps from fluctuating... That reminds me to give Moving Brews a call for that pump! I have noticed that I can manage temps better when using a thinner mash (and no scorching) approximately 1.3-1.5 qt/lb. *** My last batch, presently lagering, I rested at 153F, then 158F (George Fix has reported improved foam stand with 15 min. at this temp). I will dough in at 104 and ramp to 153 slowly. But I am not clear on how long you are recommending to rest at 153 and 158. For a crisper beer I would think resting for 45 mins at 153 and 15 mins at 158 would meet the desired goal. Please correct me if my assumptions are incorrect. *** Can/Should I use Albers Corn Meal from the grocery store in place of the flaked maize? If so, I'll give a cereal mash a try. I have a very nice rice cooker (which keeps rice nice and hot/moist for at least 3 days). It boils and steams rice. Can this be a useful tool for doing cereal mashes or decoction? It would be easy to hit sac temps on the stove and then place in cooker for a boil and keep hot until it is needed! Or should I just use it for rice and use the steamed rice for a cream ale? *** Good luck and let us know how it turns out. Oh, and congratulations on the impending arrival of the new brewer. Brew now while you can, because the next 18 years are a roller coaster ride with no getting off until the end of the ride. Right now you're on that slow clank, clank, clank up the up the first hill. The bar is down across your lap and you're locked in, but the ride hasn't really started, yet. Then you reach the top and wow! Your world is changed forever. But I wouldn't have traded my ride for anything. I will report back with my results and I truly appreciate your response. It is time to get back on the roller coaster (very nice analogy). Oh, how do I get that clanking noise in my head to stop! Keith Being blind does not bum me out... BEING OUT OF HOMEBREW DOES!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 12:05:05 -0700 From: Badger Roullett <branderr at microsoft.com> Subject: Women and Beer From: "Miller, Monica" <MMiller at dowagro.com> Subject: Re: Women Brewers " However, I do disagree with Monika's statement that "most women simply don't like beer". I don't question your observations, but I think you may be misinterpreting them. I find it hard to believe that gender determines whether one likes or dislikes beer. I do know some women who basically think they shouldn't like beer, so they aren't open to it. (And, these are usually the women who give me "the look" when I say I'm a homebrewer.) Friends of mine, both male and female, who really don't like beer also tend to be the folks who don't like strongly flavored anything. " My experience has been that Men tend to "Aquire" the taste for beer in high school, and its a guy thing. but i also like to specialize crafting beers for people who don't like the taste of "beer" beer. My lady really can't stand the taste of beer. i recently made a Honey Chamomile Amber, that changed her mind. she now has started bugging me to make more of that for her... My ex-wife hated beer too, and i made a nice mellow Blackberry wheat, that she liked, drank regularly, and the key fact was that it was loved by all. I agree that many beer is in general a Guy thing, and the media, and culture really continue to foster this image. But women can, and do Like, and Brew beer. a nice thing to do (hint for brewers with SO's who say they don't like beer) is to make a special effort to craft a beer they do like. this make relations better with the spouse, you get lotsa points when you find the recipe they like, and its an excuse to branch into possibly new areas of brewing. Me i am not a real stout bitter beer person either, so i brew nice mellow, fruity, tasty beers, and no one complains in the slightest.. badger ********************************************* Brander Roullett aka Badger Brewing Page: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/badgbeer.html Badgers Brewing Bookstore: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/brewbook.html In the SCA: Lord Frederic Badger of Amberhaven, Innkeeper of the Cat and Cup Inn Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 14:11:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Women and beer Monica writes: > However, I do disagree with Monika's statement that "most women simply >don't like beer". I don't question your observations, but I think you >may be misinterpreting them. I find it hard to believe that gender >determines whether one likes or dislikes beer. I do know some women who >basically think they shouldn't like beer, so they aren't open to it. >(And, these are usually the women who give me "the look" when I say I'm >a homebrewer.) Friends of mine, both male and female, who really >don't like beer also tend to be the folks who don't like strongly >flavored anything. Bitter foods are an aquired taste, right? There's an initial threshold that you must cross before you like bitter foods like beer. The women that I've met and known over the years appear to less prone to peer pressure then men are and "being macho" is certainly not on their list of things to do. I believe that it could be that young men's need to be accepted by their peers and the association of beer with male adulthood that might be the "big gap" between men and women in the area of drinking enough beer to get beyond that initial threshold. On the other hand, until relatively recently, "good beer" has been rare and perhaps it's just that women aren't afraid to admit that they don't like Industrial Light Lagers. I didn't like beer until my first trip to England. The beer there was so tasty that I quickly learned to love it. Upon returning, I seeked out similar-quality beer, but found it virtually unavailable. However, I did learn to semi-enjoy Industrial Light Lagers, although it took English Ales to get me to cross that initial threshold. Eventually, I started homebrewing *primarily* because I couldn't find Bitter in the US! Similarly, my wife never liked beer until her first trip to England. Beers she thought were awful before the trip were "delicious" afterwords (Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, for example..."ick" before, and now it is tied with Rodenbach Grand Cru as her favourite beer). I suggest that a week in England will cure beer-haters of both sexes... ...actually, this is a good week (first week in August) as it is when the Great British Beer Festival is held in Olympia, London. Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 12:17:28 -0700 From: Badger Roullett <branderr at microsoft.com> Subject: List of Dried Yeasts? Greeting Beer People, i was wondering if there was a good source material (such as a handy web page) for information regarding the different types of DRIED beer yeasts available.. such as floculation, flavor profiles, experiences, best with which style etc. etc. i use dry yeast, and am not really intersted right now in moving to starters because of time and frig/counter space issues with roommates. so this sort of information would be really helpful for me.. questiosn such as... which dry yeast is best in a sweet stout? which dry yeast is best when making a Pale ale? which dry yeast is best for making english ales? which dry yeast is best for doing High Gravity batches? Badger *************************************************** Brander Roullett aka Badger Homepage: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger Brewing Page: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger/badgbeer.html In the SCA: Lord Frederic Badger of Amberhaven Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 15:29:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com> Subject: Clinitest Dave again posts how superior Clinitest is to hydrometers. I, of course, disagree (even if Siebel does use it... I'm sure they also take many hydrometer and refractometer readings too!). I'd like to thank Dave for spurring me to finally put together that Clinitest page on my website. Rather than clog the HBD with the same old story, you can find my thoughts on this subject at http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/articles/clinitest.html. Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
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