HOMEBREW Digest #2899 Sat 12 December 1998

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Al K's Book (Badger Roullett)
  Gott (Christopher "R." Hebert)
  RE: Liquid Smoke (The Brew Company)
  RE: LD Carlson Fruit Flavoring (The Brew Company)
  Waffles (Christopher "R." Hebert)
  Homebrew kegging? (Brian Morgan)
  filling bottles from kegs ("Darren Robey")
  Things growing in my moist freezer ("Kensler, Paul")
  Philmills (Dan Listermann)
  Temp reguln: ferment, 2ary, bottles (Ian Lyons)
  Re: Books Under the Xmas Tree ("Robert J. Waddell")
  Grain Mills/air space ("Rob Jones")
  Converted keg mash tun ("Robert Phelan")
  Re: Storing yeast vials. (Ross Reid)
  lawyers, guns and money (AlannnnT)
  Low Carbonation in high gravity beers (Jim Welsh)
  Brew room setup ("Sandy Macmillan")
  It is braging and it is bashing ("Rick Wood")
  Water Treatments for Munich Dark Beers (Ted McIrvine)
  Protein rest (ThomasM923)
  All the beer in Deutschland ... (The Greenman)
  Re: Books Under the Xmas Tree (Scott Murman)
  Another Grain Mill opinion (Jim Grady)
  Re:  Grain Mill (John Murphy)
  Re> Chris Pittock's Questions ("Penn, John")
  pr: zum uerige ("Alan McKay")
  Dixie Blackened Voodoo Lager -- Worst Beer Ever? (Michael A. Owings)
  pr : zum uerige and the German "R" ("Alan McKay")
  on evacuating cornie kegs ("Nathaniel P. Lansing")
  Homebrewing information on the HBD page... (pbabcock)
  craft beer in the 21st century (Vachom)
  Christmas present for the server... (pbabcock)
  fusels ("Nathaniel P. Lansing")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 12:01:49 -0800 From: Badger Roullett <branderr at microsoft.com> Subject: Al K's Book > From: JPullum127 at aol.com >Subject: richards scotts book query > i'd strongly reccomend al korzonas homebrewing vol 1. not sold in stores , > but available on his website. an excellent book with many very usefull items. > you can get an idea of his knowledge from his articles on hbd. far more > usefull than homebrewing for dummies. i can't wait for vol 2. have fun I also would recomend Al K's Book. I also would really really love to see Vol. 2 in the works!!! C'mon Al, you can do it! ;) I have another suggestion though. The book is not really sold in stores, and it should be. Why don't we all (those of us who like it, and want to support a good book, and a good author) go down to our suppliers/home brew shops/grain temple and tell them about it and encourage them to stock it. Spread the word... I found it much more informative, and useful than Papazian's book (although he does deserve some respect for his work) and recomend it to my freinds. I have no connection to Al, (although I have his link on my Amazon.Com Bookstore website, so i get a few pennies if you buy the book through my website). Badger *************************************************** Brander Roullett aka Badger Homepage: http://www.nwlink.com/~badger In the SCA: Lord Frederic Badger of Amberhaven "It had to be a linguistics professor who said that it's man's ability to use language that makes him the dominant species on the planet. That may be. But I think there's one other thing that separates us from animals. We aren't afraid of vacuum cleaners." --Jeff Stilson Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 14:33:44 -0700 From: Christopher "R." Hebert <CRH at ny.rfny.rflaw.com> Subject: Gott I bought my 5 gal Gott when I started doing all-grain. Before that, when I did partial mashes, I used a collender! No vorlauf, burnt fingers and lots of hot-side aeration. Yum. Personally, I think if you got a 10-gallon Gott and used it for partial mashes, the benefits of increase extraction and clear runoff would outweigh any problems you'd encounter with a less-than-ideal grain bed depth. To me, some things are more important than others...having a clear runoff while sparging, for example, is probably something to be more concerned about than, say, grain bed depth or pH or brewing salts. I say, go for the 10-gallon Gott. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 16:57:20 -0500 (EST) From: The Brew Company <sales at brewcompany.com> Subject: RE: Liquid Smoke Dave writes: >I have a recipe calling for adding liquid smoke when bottling. > >How should I do this? Just add it (2 tablespoons) to my bottling bucket? >Boil it along with my priming sugar? Personally, I wouldn't use it. Over the weekend I judged at a local competition and came across a smoked beer. It was very obvious that the person used Liquid Smoke for the smoke flavor, and it didn't blend well. It was like taking a sip of beer, swallowing, then added a tiny drop in your tongue. If you want a smoked brew, I would use smoked malt, about 1/2 to 1 lb. This is not to be confused with smoked peated malt, I have never used it, but have heard many horror stories about it. I made a smoked porter with 1/2 lb of the smoked malt ant it turned out real nice. Many raves at a local hb club mtg. If you still decide to go for it, I would add it at bottling, *after* experimenting with a few samples first. ;-) -Skill ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Brew Company of Carlisle 717-241-2734 152 South Hanover Street (fax) 717-241-2735 Carlisle, PA 17013 www.brewcompany.com sales at brewcompany.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 16:57:28 -0500 (EST) From: The Brew Company <sales at brewcompany.com> Subject: RE: LD Carlson Fruit Flavoring Jeff writes: (stuff deleted) >I have two options: add the flavor when I rack to secondary or add it at >bottling. I would add it at bottling. These are the small bottles, right? Like 2 ounces? I have seen these recommend using the entire bottle for a 5 gallon batch but, I would start out small and work my way up. Add 1/4 bottle in the bottling bucket, stir and taste. Add another 1/4, etc. If you add too much initially, you're hosed. I wouldn't be concerned about the sugars that are included with the flavoring. -Skill ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Brew Company of Carlisle 717-241-2734 152 South Hanover Street (fax) 717-241-2735 Carlisle, PA 17013 www.brewcompany.com sales at brewcompany.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 15:11:21 -0700 From: Christopher "R." Hebert <CRH at ny.rfny.rflaw.com> Subject: Waffles In light of Al K.'s post on Fries, I'd like to point out that the Flemish are incorrectly attributed in the production of Belgian Waffles. These creatures were introduced at the 1964 NY World's Fair and, then, called Bel-Gem Waffles. Kind of a French (why? I don't know) Beauty thing, I suppose. But, those Noo Yawkers...Bel-Gem quickly became Belgian and then there was no turning back... Chris in Brooklyn, NY. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 06:40:01 +1100 (EST) From: Brian Morgan <bkm_42 at yahoo.com> Subject: Homebrew kegging? I've made several batches of ale (and liked them all...), and am interested in kegging my next batch. I have a CO2 setup for commercial barrels - what I'd like to do is put my next batch directly in the barrel from the fermenter, then use the CO2 to carbonate it (instead of sugar, reactivating the yeast, etc). I know that's probably considered sacrilege here... But how do I do it? Just fill the excess space in the barrel with CO2 under pressure, and let the beer absorb it? How long would it take, and what kind of pressure would it take? Thanks!!! And Happy Holidays! Brian Morgan bkm_42 at yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free at yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 09:29:09 +1000 From: "Darren Robey"<Darren.Robey at nre.vic.gov.au> Subject: filling bottles from kegs I know such newbie questions can get a little bornig, but any advice would be helpful. I've been kegging for a little while now, but still like to fill some bottles for taking with me when I don't want to cart a keg around. Now I haven't got a CPBF at all, but I was after any advice for filling with my normal beer gun. Any advice Very much appreciated! Darren Robey Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 16:33:32 -0600 From: "Kensler, Paul" <paul.kensler at wilcom.com> Subject: Things growing in my moist freezer Hello all, Some may remember several posts a couple of weeks ago, about reducing moisture in chest freezers by using a desiccant. I have had no luck with either kind (the pink crystal kind in a tub, or the dirt kind in a bag), so I have resigned myself to having a moist freezer. However, I still harbor some hope that I can somehow retard or eliminate the resulting mold growth. I keep the freezer at 33F, and am very careful not to spill beer (ie, nutrients) inside the freezer, but I still have a thick, nasty, black carpet on the bottom of the freezer - it almost looks like the algae carpet you get in freshwater aquariums. The one and only time I raised the temperature (for lager fermentation), the mold grew like crazy. My question: Is there any sort of anti-fungal / anti-mold / anti-mildew treatment or product I can use to retard the growth of nasty stuff? Or do I just need to add the monthly emptying / cleaning of the freezer to my list of chores? For what its worth, I don't often open the chest freezer (allowing more humid air in), and I have a typical wood collar around the top (pine 2x10 boards sealed at the joints with silicone). Any suggestions welcome. Thanks, Paul Kensler -Protesting moldy puddles in Plano, TX Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 18:04:08 -0500 From: Dan Listermann <72723.1707 at compuserve.com> Subject: Philmills Tidmarsh Major had some comments about the Philmill that I would like to address. The reason that the Philmill clamps to a table is that I found mills that were mounted on top of buckets, while apealing on the surface, were difficult to hold down while cranking. The hopper ( a two liter pop bottle ) is very servicable and easily and inexpensively acquired. I prefer a three liter bottle, but they are not universally available and require a larger mounting hole. We can supply a mounting block with a larger hole or anyone can make one using a 1.5 dia. hole saw. An adapter that can be screwed to the existing mounting block can be made the same way. Another alternative is to simply construct a hopper and screw the mill to it. A 5 gallon plastic carboy is a fantastic hopper that will easily hold 20 lbs of malt. I encourage motorizing the Philmill especially with a common 1/2" electric hand drill. The later models need a headless 3/8" shoulder bolt ( stripper bolt ) to adapt it to power. We also sell these. The mill does eject grist at an angle from vertical. The best way to control this is to construct a funnel with another two liter pop bottle. Cut the bottom out, poke a hole for the crank shaft and another at 90 degrees for the adjustment screw. Simple hang the funnel from these holes and the grist will fall vertically with very little dust in a one inch diameter stream. If one must have a two roll mill, just wait a little while. The best is yet to come..... Dan Listermann dan at listermann.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 10:40:31 +1030 From: Ian Lyons <ilyons at biochem.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Temp reguln: ferment, 2ary, bottles Dear collective wisdom There's been a little bit of chat about the (lack of ) welcome for beginners in this news group. As such a beginner let me thank you for the welcome and the help and info flow I have received over the last few months. During that time I have been advised on the malting and kilning of grain, mash brewing, and have even skimmed through the esoterica of laminar flow through grain beds. The upshot is that I have just opened my first mash brewed beer, a pilsner and have been rewarded for all the effort! Great texture: mouth feel and head retention. Aromatic, firm hop finish. AND it's only been in the bottle 3 weeks. I expect it to integrate and soften more over the next couple of months. (BTW: 5kg pale malt (stepped stove top mash, and first up mash efficiency of 85%!), 90g Saaz hops x 60 minutes boil, ferment 8-12oC, RO water to emulate pilsn water, and SAFLAGER dried yeast bcs the Wyeast bohemian starter smelt funny). Here's the next round of questions: Even though I can control the primary ferment, the technology I have requires a secondary at ambient (15-25oC depending on season). Is this a problem? Tell me more about diacetyl rest? I'm reading about it, but I don't get it! After bottling 'pilsner' I don't have any deep caves to lager it in. Again storage is a problem. Typically I have stored my brews outside the house, which in South australia at this time of year is 15-42oC! what is the likely effect of this? How desparately should i fight for inside storage space? thanks again for past (and future) advice! Ian Lyons ilyons at biochem.adelaide.edu (DOT au, bcs that's where I am) Ian Lyons BresaGen Cell and Molecular Biology Laboratory Department of Biochemistry The University of Adelaide Adelaide South Australia AUSTRALIA 5005 Phone 61 8 8303 5353 FACS 61 8 8303 4348 ilyons at biochem.adelaide.edu.au Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 17:38:00 -0700 From: "Robert J. Waddell" <rjw at dimensional.com> Subject: Re: Books Under the Xmas Tree "Chuck Bernard" <bernardch at mindspring.com> wrote: >Back to the request. . . If I could only keep two HB books from my >library, they would be (in no particular order) >"Designing Great Beers," by Ray Daniels >"Homebrewing - Volume I," by Al Korzonas Great choices Chuck, and I'd like to add one more. When I attended the "World Beer Forum" at the GABF this year (sponsored by the Keg Ran Out Club) I won a door prize that was donated by Brian Rezac of the AHA. It was the book: Beer In America/ The Early Years--1587-1840, written by Gregg Smith. It was one of the best reads of non-fiction that I've ever read. It gave me plenty of ammunition to use against the liberal nannies and the ultra-right wing Bible thumpers. Being a (sometimes rabid) patriot, it really justified my philosophy concerning brewing and consuming what I brew. (If anyone feels the urge to debate my politics, let's do it off-line) #%^) Just wanted to cast a vote, and explain why. RJW I *L*O*V*E* my [Pico] system. 'Cept for that gonging noise it makes when my wife throws it off the bed at night. Women... --Pat Babcock *** It's never too late to have a happy childhood! *** ******************************************************************** RJW at dimensional.com / Opinions expressed are usually my own but Robert J. Waddell / perhaps shared. ICQ #7136012 Owner & Brewmaster: Barchenspeider Brew-Haus Longmont, Colorado ******************************************************************** (4,592 feet higher than Jeff Renner) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 21:24:59 -0600 From: "Rob Jones" <robjones at pathcom.com> Subject: Grain Mills/air space I'd like to put a plug in for the Canadian made Valley Mill. I've used one at a friend's BOP, and it does a great job every time. Has two fully adjustalble knurled rollers and is easily motorized. Herb writes about the best crush being somewhere between settings... we've found that the best crush is obtained buy slightly undercrushing on the first run, then jumping up one notch and running the grist through again. This appears to maximize the grain crush but minimize the husk damage. (Not affiliated, just pushing made in Canada. We've got to be able to compete within NAFTA somehow! Oh yeah, there is that wheat dumping thing as well...) Concerning air space... when I've been feeling particularly anal about oxidation, which usually involves my lambics that are in the bottle for a few years, I've attached a picnic tap to my gas line. I shoot a little CO2 into each bottle before filling and hopefully purge some of the O2. I keep the regulator pressure low in hopes that the CO2 doesn't just blast into then straight out of the relatively small space. Otherwise I don't worry about, and have never had a problem. When using my CPBF I try to get just enough foaming to effectiviely cap on foam. Rob Jones, Toronto Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 18:43:07 PST From: "Robert Phelan" <rephelan at excite.com> Subject: Converted keg mash tun I need a little help. Every converted keg mash tun I'vve seen uses a false bottom or equalilent with some sort of bottom to side siphon for extraction. My basic question is, WHY? Wouldn't simply draining straight out the bottom of the tun work just the same? If not, why not? Some friends of mine opperate a small micro here in town using a converted milk vessel (about 1250 gals) as a mash tun and drain from the bottom through 2 "v" screens. Seems to work well for them. Has anybody tried bottom drainig from a mash tun? All thoughts would be appreciated before I cut my kegs into scrap metal. Thanks _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private e-mail at http://mail.excite.com/ Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 02:52:40 GMT From: mrreid at golden.net (Ross Reid) Subject: Re: Storing yeast vials. In HBD#2895 Scott Murman asked for an inexpensive convenient way to store his large collection of 1 dram vials. As well as a home brewer, I have also been a reloader. For a good, secure, sturdy storage container, I'd suggest trying a gun shop. There are several manufacturers of polycarbonate ammunition boxes with individual spaces for various sized cartridges. MTM is a good one that comes to mind. While I have no idea of the size of a 1 dram vial, there should be an ammo box that will fit them. Some of the MTM boxes have hinged lids and hold 50 cartridges. Cheers, Ross. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 23:07:43 EST From: AlannnnT at aol.com Subject: lawyers, guns and money Hi all, About site glasses. Wouldn't it make a great fund raiser for the HBD? We could make barware with the HBD slogan, or t's or mash paddles or something. (For the next major computer hardware purchase.) My choice for slogan? "I live 500 miles from Jeff Renner" Or "It's clinitest or no test at all" Or "Botjulism- If you can't spell it, it can't Hurt you" Or "Malt Mills cure Alcoholism" Or, maybe just "post@hbd.org" Answers to a few postings; Someone posted that Al K's book is not available in stores. Hogwash! Many homebrew stores carry it. As well they should. RE: Fruit extracts containing fermentables. Even if LD Carlsen's extract does have a small percentage of fermentable sugar, it should not effect bottle conditioning. With the experience of many hundreds of fruit extract beers, I've never had a complaint or problem reported to me, in my shop. Co2 and air and oxygen. Sometimes posters seem to have trouble with the idea of heavy CO2 and lighter O2 and all that. Let's think of it this way- If gases didn't mix all the time, we'd all be dead. All the heavy gases would be down here with us. All the light oxygen would be up there, where the birds go. One good volcano eruption would kill us all. All this talk about homemalting makes me want to point this out. Malting rye at home can be dangerous. I have checked this out in a few published sources and they all say the same. There is a toxic spore you can grow on rye, and it's allegedly very toxic. I hate to be so vague here. Maybe Al K. can help with more specifics. - ------------------------------ Michael Jackson, beer writer, not the other one, was on Conan Obrien last night. I feel privileged and honored to one of the very few people on the planet to have tasted both of the beers that MK opened for sampling. One was Brooklyn Chocolate Stout. In case you don't know, that's the dessert beer served in Heaven. Made by Garett Oliver, Brooklyn Brewing. The other, Southampton's Eisbock is the beer served by the Devil himself. It's made by Phil Markowski, Southampton Publick House, Southampton, NY. The best guess is that it's between 16 and 18 percent alcohol by volume. It is not available anywhere! (except from Phil). It is sad that Conan has no respect for beer or beer writers, he was a bit too clownish. He's just another Bud guy. - ------------------------------ Other interesting books out there include; A Sip Through Time, by Cindy Refrow. It is just for those interested in historical brewing techniques. A lot of brewing with honey in this book. Also, Homebrewers Garden. I don't remember the author, sorry, but it's new and from Storey pub. Just what you'd think from it's title. Also, a lot of homebrewshops now have the AHA style books available very cheap. You could get a spouse to pick up five different for $25.00 or so. Still worth having, even if they do say AHA on them. - ------------------------------- About Charlie and the HBD. Don't you think that they (the HBD) could put some homebrewing information on the page? Anyone out there have any pull with them? They should have a how to brew page, shouldn't they? ____________________ Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, Joyous Kwanza and a Peaceful Channukah to all! Alan T E Npt, New York USA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 22:50:11 -0600 From: Jim Welsh <jwelsh at execpc.com> Subject: Low Carbonation in high gravity beers I recently bottled two high gravity beers, a belgian dubbel and a holiday spice ale (both O.G. at 1.084). Both were in secondary for 3 1/2 weeks before priming with 3/4 cup corn sugar and then bottling. Both were bottled 4 weeks ago and placed in a room with a temperature of ~68F. The problem I am having is that they both are very low in carbonation. I have brewed numerous all grain batches before and have had great success with my priming technique. My question is if anyone has any suggestions as to how to increase the carbonation after the beer is in the bottle. I am thinking of placing the beer in a large cooler with 75F water to increase the temperature but I am afraid of off flavors from the yeast. Any suggestions would be appreciated as the beers taste great though need more carbonation. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 09:19:23 +0300 From: "Sandy Macmillan" <scotsman at ncc.moc.kw> Subject: Brew room setup The subject of brew room layout is still a matter of individual preferences, but here are some thoughts on the Building Services side. If you use a burner then you need air for combustion, you also need air to cool the room and finally you need to remove the vapour from the boil. The classic approach on vapour control is to use a hood to trap the vapour and a fan to exhaust the vapour and hot air. There is a direct relationship between the output of your burner and the combustion air required. The cooling effect is normally calculated as the output of the burner should only raise the room temperature by 10 F, this can be 20 F if you use a hood. Some of the best designs use a two speed fan. Low speed extract and supply to maintain the room in a well ventilated situation and the high speed when a full rolling boil is required. In this case do nit waste money on a quiet fan at the high speed. The noise of a burner and boil generally will mask the fan. The hood design is pretty simple but make sure you have enough head room, many chefs have big bumps on their heads. You can organise the inlet if possible to be low down and near the floor, then the hood directly over the boil pot / cooker. If you measure the height from the edge of the hood to the bottom of the brew pot and then multiple that dimension by the perimeter if the hood (both in feet) and multiply that area by 150 you will get a preliminary fan size. Generally it is good practice to extract about 10% more air than supply to stop the smells travelling all over the house. The heat exchanger comments are true. The simplest method is two coils one in the discharge air duct and one in the fresh air supply. A small pump circulates the water between the coils. If hot air is discharged then the coil in the exhaust duct is warmer and the warm water is then used to heat the fresh air coming into the house. The same concept is used if you are air conditioning in the summer. There are several other methods, such as a rotating wheel that transfer the energy. One big consideration is hygiene. The typical temperatures involves encourage bugs etc. to really grow. The coil method allows the ducts to be quite separate, the wheel means the ducts have to be adjacent Please also take care on the plumbing side. A floor drain and a tiled floor can really improve hygiene. Exposed pipes are quite often used in a basement, if you do this make sure you can clean behind them. I would suggest a visit or two to a canteen or medium sized kitchen would show you some of the pitfall and suggested solutions. Have a look at a rice cooker hood and a deep fat fryer hood to see what a mess can be made. All the above are general comments and should be interpreted as such. The real answer lies in the details of the system design. If you can seek a local HVAC engineers advise, (fees can be liquid!) so much the better. Sandy Macmillan Brewer and engineer Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 16:46:11 +1100 From: "Rick Wood" <thewoods at netpci.com> Subject: It is braging and it is bashing Hello HBD, Yogi excepted, I think most of us can tell the difference between someone bragging and his humble explanation of ability. And I think most of us can tell the difference between criticism and bashing. And further, I think most of us think that change is more likely with helpful criticism as opposed to some of the hateful bashing that we have seen. I think Spencer's statement demonstrates criticism that is useful: "And we all hope that Brian and Paul will turn the AHA back into an organization that truly provides SERVICES to its MEMBERS. History does not bode well for this hope, as we've seen too many others with good intentions for the AHA get squashed in the process." Rick Wood Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 14:37:32 -0800 From: Ted McIrvine <McIrvine at ix.netcom.com> Subject: Water Treatments for Munich Dark Beers First, I want to thank everyone from HBD who has corresponded with me. I've never had such informed, helpful, and polite comments from a group on a list-serve. I brew with New York (Staten Island) tap water, which I boil prior to mashing or sparging (and then cool to the desired temperature). I haven't had a water analysis, but I'm told that this water is slightly acidic and generally free of carbonates. (I've tested it for my aquarium, and it was about 6.7-6.8 PH with very few minerals.) I'm brewing some dark Munich lager beers, which I find far more challenging than brewing Belgian ales. I'm wondering what methods one uses to determine acidity, and what water treatments would be appropriate. This time for a Doppelbock, I used two tablespoons of Calcium Carbonate (and acidified my sparge with 3 oz of crushed chocolate malt). Any thoughts about water treatment and methods of checking PH for this style? Parenthetically, I'd like to add my two cents to the discussion on malt mills. I bought a Schmidling malt mill, and it was the most useful piece of brewing equipment I've bought. I'm not going to motorize it, I like the spirituality of grinding grain by hand, even for a Barleywine. Ted McIrvine Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 02:51:20 EST From: ThomasM923 at aol.com Subject: Protein rest Matt Grady wrote: "I brewed 5 batches last fall/winter/spring with the specific intent of determining if protein rests could reduce chill haze and/or improve foam stand in my brews... ...My qualitative conclusion is that these beers were <more> prone to chill haze, and had very poor foam stand. The chill haze is more subjective (I have no 'Formazin Turbidiy Unit' measurements to quote!), but the lack of head retention is obvious/unquestionable." Matt- What kind of malt did you use? I notice that some of the beers you tried the protein rest out on where British types, so I gather you used British malts for these. A protein rest with British malts will result in a poor foam stand, at the very least. I know that a protein rest is an extra step, but I always include one when using 2-row and pilsner malts and I always seem to get a nice mouth-feel and a long-lasting head. However, I've never tried it any other way, so I can't say for sure whether or not I would get the same results if I skipped the rest. It would be interesting to do a side-by-side test (one batch with a rest, the other without, all other things being equal). Perhaps in my next life... Thomas Murray Maplewood, NJ Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 01:12:21 -0700 From: The Greenman <greenman at sdc.org> Subject: All the beer in Deutschland ... Greetings brothers and sisters in brewing: When I last had the pleasure (and the money) to visit Germany my first beer, and my last, (and more than quite a few in between) was Altbeir. This is the beer that turned me into a beer a snob. I tried every single brand I could. I even had the pleasure of trying one brewpub's "Sticke Alt" (secret) which I was informed was only for the loyal patron's, town politicians, and other bigshots (boy was I flattered! of course I doubt if I fit in that criteria) Now I'm a homebrewer, and a homebrew snob. I'm an extract brewer, and while I'd love to go all-grain, it can't happen right now. I have been working with wyeast #1007 and #1338 and all of my brewing has been in preparation for making a great alt. I can cold condition my beer at lager temps, so I can get the clean profile associated with the beers in question. The extract I can most readily get for the beer is IREKS. But don't let that stop you. I looking to get some good tried and true recipes from people that have been to the Duesseldorf area of Germany, or who have some good alts. The more authentic the better. Private mail is fine, but posting the digest would allow anyone who is as curious as I am to get the recipe. Thank you, thank you, thank you in advance! - -- .-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-. T. Daniel "Greenman" Griffin Socorro, NM (aka podunkville) "Knowledge is the herald of Sorrow" "When it is dark enough, you can see the stars" Student/Spod/ANGSTer/Brother/SysAdmin '-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-' Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 22:48:13 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Murman <smurman at best.com> Subject: Re: Books Under the Xmas Tree Michael Jackson's Beer Companion Michael Jackson's Great Beers of Belgium Both will motivate you to brew styles you never considered before. The first is a nice hardcover coffee-table book that makes a nice X-mas present. They both have enough info on cloning classic beers that you won't be disappointed on not buying a "brewing text". -SM- Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 07:42:04 -0500 From: Jim Grady <jim_grady at hp.com> Subject: Another Grain Mill opinion I've had one of Jack Schmidling's malt mills for a little over 5 years. It has performed VERY well. As far as mounting it goes, I used lag bolts to fix it to my workbench in the basement rather than set it over the top of a bucket. I also noticed a "Automatic Roller Mill" (so named because it's made by the Automatic Equipment Company) in the latest catalog from William's Brewing. You can get a picture and more details at: http://www.williamsbrewing.com/newpage1.htm#Grain Mills It's more expensive than others I've seen ($179) but if I were buying a grain mill now, I would give this one serious consideration. Again, I am very happy with my MaltMill from JSP. Disclaimer: I've never even seen one, let alone use one. Usual disclaimer: I have no financial interest in William's Brewing. - -- Jim Grady Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 08:04:00 -0500 From: John Murphy <jbm at ll.mit.edu> Subject: Re: Grain Mill Sandy Macmillan writes: > >Thanks to all the kind people who responded to my "Mill" enquiry. The >comments were all frank and I feel the need to publish them for all. >I had comments on the following Schmidling Malt (JSP)Mill, Phil Mill, Valley >Mill, and Corona. > >1. Corona simple but generally felt for small operational use only. Cannot >be safely motorised. Sandy, For a long time (many moons ago), local homebrew shops here used motorized Corona mills as the shop mill for customers. Cheers John Murphy jbm at ll.mit.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 09:34:51 -0500 From: "Penn, John" <John.Penn at jhuapl.edu> Subject: Re> Chris Pittock's Questions I originally posted this email privately but it bounced so I'll waste a little bandwidth of the HBD. Chris (from Down Under), I've never had a problem with Goldings but it sounds like they were close to fresh if they were sealed and fresh smelling. You certainly can get more aroma from dry hopping but its a different aroma than late hops. I usually add aroma hops at the end of the boil and try to cool quickly. Cooling too slow or adding the hops earlier like -5 to -10 mins pretty much reduces the aroma too. re. Phenolic Taste... Do they chlorinate the water down under? I've heard thats a common problem in the US so most people use charcoal water filters or pre-boil the water to try and remove the chlorine/chloramine. Hope you find out the cause for your off test. Its always tough. Has the taste changed with time? Was the taste off just when the beer was still "green"/young? John Penn Eldersburg, MD USA Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 09:57:15 -0500 From: "Alan McKay" <Alan.McKay.amckay at nt.com> Subject: pr: zum uerige Greetings, I'm going to be putting up some WAV files at "zum" is "TZOOM" with the "TZ" on top of each other. And the "OO" is not drawn as long as in English. "uerige" roughly "EUR-ig-eh" with "EUR" like EUROPE but take the "Y" sound off the front of it. I lived in Germany 2 years and am very fluent. cheers, -Alan p.s. Just noticed in re-reading that I've confused matters here. The '-eh' on the end is not the same "eh" that us Canadians supposedly say all the time. It's meant to be like "ah" only with an "e". In other words, the 'e' at the end is not silent. It's tough to spell what it sounds like, so just go to the URL I gave. - -- Alan McKay <<...>> Norstar Desktop Computing and LAN Solutions PC Support Prime amckay at nortelnetworks.com 765-6843 (ESN 395) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 15:24:55 GMT From: mikey at swampgas.com (Michael A. Owings) Subject: Dixie Blackened Voodoo Lager -- Worst Beer Ever? In HBD 2898 John_Simonetta at ittsheraton.com sayeth: > This brewery, with its "pervasive aroma of ammonia" does > seem like a fitting place to me for the production of the > above brew - possibly the worst beer > I've ever had. Really? Worse than Zima? Bud Lite? It's been a couple of years since I've had it, but I seem to remember it being a pretty decent beer -- Michael Jackson even gives BVL a favorable mention in "The Beer Companion". Maybe you got a bad bottle? Maybe it really _does_ suck these days ... I shall pick up a six pack tonight and test the latter hypothesis. Speaking of which, any nominees in the Worst Beer Ever Category? No fair picking on the Megabrews -- too obvious. I myself shall boldly nominate SA Triple Bock. I tried to like it, I really did -- even self hypnosis was to no avail. It still tasted like a bunch of random, sugar-rich crap thrown together and allowed to rot -- er, ferment. Nice bottles, though. - -- Michael "Not that my regional pride is wounded or anything" Owings, Covington, Louisiana - approximately 162,217,440 centimeters from Jeff Renner *********************** Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change. The courage to change the things I can. *** And the wisdom to hide the bodies of the people I had to kill because they pissed me off *** Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 10:26:26 -0500 From: "Alan McKay" <Alan.McKay.amckay at nt.com> Subject: pr : zum uerige and the German "R" Spencer Thomas wrote : > The u-umlaut sound is one that does not appear in English. You can > make a close approximation by placing your tongue in the position you > use for the "long E" sound, but pursing your lips as you do for the > "long OO" sound. Hey, that's actually not bad. I wish someone had told it to me that way when I was trying to learn it. > As I recall, the German "R" is trilled briefly at the front of the > tongue. My phonetics teacher in Koeln told us that the German "R" can be properly trilled either on the front of the tongue (more northern) or on the back of the tongue (more southern). I can't do the front one, but don't have any problems with the back one. cheers, -Alan - -- Alan McKay <<...>> Norstar Desktop Computing and LAN Solutions PC Support Prime amckay at nortelnetworks.com 765-6843 (ESN 395) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 10:25:05 -0500 From: "Nathaniel P. Lansing" <delbrew at compuserve.com> Subject: on evacuating cornie kegs Someone mentioned using a vacuum pump to evacuate the oxygen from kegs to minimize CSA. These are pressure vessels and though they can stand 130 psig they wouldn't stand up to the the vacuum needed to purge the oxygen, unless you _wanted_ to turn your 5 gallon kegs to 3 gallon kegs. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 10:49:00 -0500 (EST) From: pbabcock <pbabcock at mail.oeonline.com> Subject: Homebrewing information on the HBD page... Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager... Alan T sez... > About Charlie and the HBD. Don't you think that they (the HBD) could put > some homebrewing information on the page? Anyone out there have any pull > with them? They should have a how to brew page, shouldn't they? If you're suggesting we (the HBD) put information on the AHA site, um, no. We have plenty enough to maintain on our own without adding any of the AHA woes to it. If you're referring to our site (HTTP://HBD.ORG), the information IS there via links to many quality homebrewing and homebrewing club pages. Also, the HBD site is being redeveloped offline to enhance its utility for those who use it. Look for very CLEAR links to pertinent information (like how to subscribe and unsubscribe, brewing documents, etc.). In this regard, we do listen to those who provide input to our functions. But, since this is a truly volunteer, labor of love kind of thing, we don't necessarily have time to implement all of the suggestions we receive right away. I expect to be able to rollout the newly structured pages after a few more weeks of sleepless nights... See ya! -p Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 09:45:26 -0600 From: Vachom <MVachow at newman.k12.la.us> Subject: craft beer in the 21st century To Tim Green's objection to paying $8 for a six of crappy craft brew, I say a resounding, "Yeah, you right." And consumers of craft brewed beer around the country are saying the same. Craft brewers are responding with creative business savvy: distribution alliances, industry consortia, massive consolidation, expansive financing. All of this sophisticated business practice, however, troubles our image of the craft brewer as a kind of grassroots rebel taking on the giant forces of homogenized, taste-free alco-pop. Now that it's clear that specialty beer is here to stay, big brewers and other financiers are jumping in with their own products and, increasingly, with their own money. This last notion is a no-brainer: micro breweries need cash, the kind of cash they need is chump change to a brewer like A/B. How much of an interest in Redhook does A/B have to have before you stop calling it a craft brewery and begin calling it a subsidiary? What about Miller and Shipyard and Celis? What about contract brewers? What about your favorite local label which is, in fact, now owned (along with the best-selling labels of five other local micro breweries) by a real estate holding company whose majority shareholders are 4 absentee Brazilian proctologists and Daimler-Chrysler? Does it matter that they continue to brew some of the best beer in the country? I'm guessing that the majority of consumers will say "who cares?" to all but the last question. They'll vote with their wallets in the marketplace and buy the best beer for the best price. The up-side of this trend is that it has the potential to keep brewers focused on quality. The worst part of this trend is that some really good beers brewed by excellent craftsmen who either don't possess the business savvy or are simply in the wrong place at the wrong time will be gone forever. Mike New Orleans, LA Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 11:01:02 -0500 (EST) From: pbabcock <pbabcock at mail.oeonline.com> Subject: Christmas present for the server... Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager.... Every year at this time, we plan a Christmas present for the HBD server. Year 1, we got the initial server together and went on line with the new, old HBD. Year 2, we added memory and backup capability. This year, we are REPLACING the server qith one of greater capacity. The machine has been ordered and is on it's way. Unfortunately, it was not wholly containable in the remaining HBD funds. Still required to complete the installation is a new SCSI card and a NIC. Also, the domain name comes up for renewal this year. The replacement of the server gets us to that final step where we have drop-in replacement capability fo rthe HBD server in case of any catastrophic hardware failure (the back-up device was the first step in this progression). Our plan this year is to drop the new server in place with as many software upgrades as we can manage (operating system, in particular), pull the old server out, and refurb it for an emergency box. The increased capacity will give us the space necessary for future enhancements such as increased SPAM prevention, additional brewpage hosting and, ultimately, a more feature rich Digest itself. If you can spare a few dollars this year in support of the Digest Server, we, and those using the Digest now and in the future, surely appreciate it! Please send check or money order made payable to Pat Babcock (HBD does not have a bank account) to: HBD Server Fund PO Box 1966 Rolla, MO 65402 And thank you! See ya! -p Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 10:25:04 -0500 From: "Nathaniel P. Lansing" <delbrew at compuserve.com> Subject: fusels Pete Czerpak says/asks >>Also, I didn't use a starter >>What things can be done to minimize fusel alcohol formation? Most commonly two things, high fermentation temperatures and fermenting on trub increase fusels. Making a normal gravity stout with a 3 liter starter, then pitching the yeast slurry to the Imperial stout would be the way to go. Since high gravity beers need double the starter size, your beer would have needed approaching a 2 gallon starter, so for the bother of that large of starter you may as well make a second beer. Pitch the starter into the Imperial Stout allowing a coupla hours of settling time then rack the beer off the cold break. Keep the fermentation temperature controlled, around 72 degrees F would avoid overt fusel character. Return to table of contents
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