HOMEBREW Digest #3033 Tue 18 May 1999

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  RE: magnetic stirrers (John_E_Schnupp)
  all grain brewing ("Earl & Karen Bright")
  AHA First Round Results (Mark Tumarkin)
  re : Primetab ("Alan McKay")
  European Caps ("J. Matthew Saunders")
  Cats and "catty" (Nathan Kanous)
  Hardware question ("Steve Milito, M.D.")
  Ruddles Best Bitter and Stone's Best Bitter. (Brad McMahon)
  Anybody have a recipe that clones Corona? ("J. Doug Brown")
  metric (Jeff Renner)
  Re: Ruddles Best Bitter and Stone's Best Bitter (Jeff Renner)
  Re:   (Some Guy) and the 2000 AHA Home Brewers' Conference (Scott Abene)
  Re: Outside Burners (Pvrozanski)
  offensive remarks/ mag stirrers/ yellow hops/ water pH (fwd) (ALAN KEITH MEEKER)
  Jethro's volume of diacetyl (Jeremy Bergsman)
  Re: HERMS Piping (RobertJ)
  Magnetic stirrers ("Mercer, David")
  It's the water...? (Jeffry D Luck)
  False Bottom (Thomas S Barnett)
  Burners (Andrew Marsh)
  Beer laws (John Wilkinson)
  HBD Bouncer? (John Wilkinson)
  Pickled Hop Shoots (beanish)
  stirring ?= aeration (Scott Murman)
  Dialectic corrosion between SS/Copper/Alu? ("Alan McKay")
  RE: HERMS Piping (LaBorde, Ronald)
  Compatible with hops (BrewInfo)
  Bottling (William Frazier)
  RE: Is it just me....or (John Wilkinson)
  Cats, Skunks and still more Cats! ("Phil and Jill Yates")
  Beer Festival (Scott Johnson)
  Cats (William Frazier)

Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! 2000 MCAB Qualifiers: Spirit of Free Beer! Competition 5/22/99 (http://burp.org/SoFB99); Oregon Homebrew Festival 5/22/99 (http://www.mtsw.com/hotv/fest.html); Buzz-Off! Competition 6/26/99 (http://www.voicenet.com/~rpmattie/buzzoff) Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org. **SUBSCRIBE AND UNSUBSCRIBE REQUESTS MUST BE SENT FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, the autoresponder and the SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE commands will fail! Contact brewery at hbd.org for information regarding the "Cat's Meow" Back issues are available via: HTML from... http://hbd.org Anonymous ftp from... ftp://hbd.org/pub/hbd/digests ftp://ftp.stanford.edu/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer AFS users can find it under... /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer COPYRIGHT for the Digest as a collection is currently held by hbd.org (Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen). Digests in their entirity CANNOT be reprinted/reproduced without this entire header section unless EXPRESS written permission has been obtained from hbd.org. Digests CANNOT be reprinted or reproduced in any format for redistribution unless said redistribution is at absolutely NO COST to the consumer. COPYRIGHT for individual posts within each Digest is held by the author. Articles cannot be extracted from the Digest and reprinted/reproduced without the EXPRESS written permission of the author. The author and HBD must be attributed as author and source in any such reprint/reproduction. (Note: QUOTING of items originally appearing in the Digest in a subsequent Digest is exempt from the above. Home brew clubs NOT associated with organizations having a commercial interest in beer or brewing may republish articles in their newsletters and/or websites provided that the author and HBD are attributed. ASKING first is still a great courtesy...) JANITORS on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 02:18:48 -0700 From: John_E_Schnupp at amat.com Subject: RE: magnetic stirrers >I really would like to build a huge monger to put my carboy on top of and >slowly stir the fermenter (bye bye to CO2 poisoning), and see what happens. I've tried that and it didn't work too well. The problem is that the glass on the bottom of the carboy (center) is quite thick and really doesn't allow great coupling between the magnet and stir bar. I was trying to use a 3 gallon carboy as I was making a starter for a lager. I used to use and erlenmeyer flask (100 ml) but found it to be insufficient, especially for larger starters. I then went with a 2000 mL flask and still had problems with it. The problem with an e-flask is that as the flask tapers the volume gets significantly less and this pushes the yeast further up the neck. I now use a 4L wine jug, which is great for ale starters but on the small side for lagers, which is why I was trying to get my 3 gallon carboy to work with my stirrer. I typically don't allow/force the yeast to floc until the very end, this way I'm not continually selecting the most flocculant (least attenuating) yeast as I step up the starter. I just continue to add starter wort, in the necessary steps, until I reach the desired volume. At this point, after the yeast is finished, I stop the stirrer and chill it. On brewday, I rack off the spent starter and add about a pint of fresh starter to revive the yeast. I use an aquarium pump and a HEPA filter to aerate the yeast. I got my filter from William's (std disclaimer) but you can probably get them anywhere. I use a rubber stopper that has a fitting I made that allows gas to flow in and out thru the same hole. Depending upon the size of your stopper, you may be able to *drill* a second hole (some time ago there was a discussion about this, search the archives) and use one hole as filtered air in and to the other attach a blowoff tube. I'm very pleased with my stirrer. I'm not sure if I get more or better yeast but I have to noticed that lag times seem to be less. At the very least the stirrer is good to mix up the slurry on brewday. I always had a problem/concern about shaking the heck out of my flask to get the yeast off the bottom, it never happened but I could always picture it slipping and loosing the battle with gravity. John Schnupp, N3CNL Dirty Laundry Brewery Colchester, VT 95 XLH 1200 Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:16:00 -0400 From: "Earl & Karen Bright" <denali at epix.net> Subject: all grain brewing I am attempting my first batch of bear using all grains, (no extracts) hjow long do I steep the grains for ? and at what temperature? Please help!!!! THANKS! Earl and Karen Bright denali at epix.net Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:39:49 -0400 From: Mark Tumarkin <mark_t at ix.netcom.com> Subject: AHA First Round Results Kim Thompson asks: "Has anyone received their results from the AHA first round in Kansas City? A few of us here sent in entries and haven't received a reply. Must not have been the winning beers they were in our comp.?" I haven't recieved any notification either (I sent mine to the first round in Tallahassee, FL), so I went and looked at the AHA website and found the following: "Second-round entries must be received at the appropriate site between Monday, June 14, and 5 p.m. on Friday, June 18, 1999. Notification will be mailed byMay 21 with additional instructions if your entry advances to the second round." If they mail it be May 21 (this coming Friday), we should get it sometime early the following week - maybe?? I quess that gives me time to get my 2nd round entries mailed off in time (might as well be optimistic, eh?). Pat Babcock mentions holding the Year 2000 convention in Detroit so we can meet him and be convinced he's not just some sort of AI cyber personality. Sounds all right by me, but does that mean you're not going to Kansas City, Pat? Anyone else going? I'd love to get the chance to share a few beers with any HBDrs who'll be there, let me know. Mark Tumarkin Gainesville, FL Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 08:35:58 -0400 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: re : Primetab Greetings, I haven't used them yet, but I got some "demo" samples from the manufacturer. They arrived late last week and I plan to use them in my next brew to review for my webiste. Without trying them, I have to say that I think the idea is one that is a long time coming. I'm very suprized that nobody thought of this before. I'd be tempted to bottle-prime my beer again if these things work as well as they should. The first thing I noted was that not a single tablet was broken, and there was absolutely no sugar-dust inside. That's actually pretty impressive considering the size of the bags. I had thought there would be a few broken ones - but nope. In the instructions the manufacturer says you can avoid syphoning to the bottling bucket. I really wouldn't recommend that since you'd likely end up with more sediment in your bottles. Aside from this, though, I'm putting my money on them being a winner. cheers, -Alan - -- Alan McKay OS Support amckay at nortelnetworks.com Small Site Integration 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) Nortel Networks http://www.magma.ca/~bodnsatz/brew/tips/ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 08:44:14 -0400 From: "J. Matthew Saunders" <saunderm at vt.edu> Subject: European Caps Kim answers: >1. Zemo askes about caps for european champagne bottles. > >Homebrew Shops supplied by Crosby and Baker can order 29 mm caps that >might fit and some handcappers have reversable jaws that will fit the >champagne bottles. Vintage Cellar at www.vintagecellar.com has them. I don't know what the price is, but you can ask at sales at vintagecellar.com. Cheers! Matthew in VA Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 07:44:07 -0500 From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu> Subject: Cats and "catty" Phil Yates appears to have found his beer "skunky" and attributed it to the neighbors cat because in the UK and Australia (note his address) they don't have skunks and talk about those odors / flavors as being "catty". I bet that if Dave Humes had noticed this (I didn't until Phil mentioned Mexican beer) then he wouldn't have taken so much offense. If anybody wants to grab a "stink kitty" by the tail and swing it around, go for it. Here is one fairly clear example of a communication gap that exists in cyberspace. No offense to anyone involved. Now that I understand what Phil was referring to, I find the whole thing just a little more funny. We need someone to ship Phil a "stink-O-gram" that allows him to understand what a skunk really is like...if he still wants to swing one of them "kitties" over his head....go for it. Later. nathan in madison, wi Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 09:10:13 -0400 From: "Steve Milito, M.D." <milito at radonc.musc.edu> Subject: Hardware question I am in the process of building a moderate capacity 3-tier brewing system. I had a welder make the stand, and modify my kettles. I found three inexpensive, high pressure, burners. I am now ready to finish my "master piece". Does anybody have any suggestion on the best way to hook up the burners. The jets are 3/8" flare. I would like to design it so that the burners have independent flow (needle valves), ball valves for on/off, but only one regulator. I reluctant to use compression fittings, because I am concerned about propane leaks. What is the best material for the tubing? What types of fittings should I use? Any suggestions would be appreciated. Best Regards, SM Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 22:43:30 +0930 From: Brad McMahon <brad at sa.apana.org.au> Subject: Ruddles Best Bitter and Stone's Best Bitter. >I am trying to brew facsimilies of Ruddles Best Bitter, >and Stone's Best Bitter. >If anyone has a recipe, it would be greatly appreciated. I have a recipe for Ruddles County, but not for Best Bitter. Now, being that breweries tend to use the same ingredients albeit in different proportions you would be looking at using: Halcyon Pale Malt Crystal Malt Black Malt Sugar. Northdown hops Challenger hops Golding hops. Brad McMahon Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 13:40:40 +0000 From: "J. Doug Brown" <jbrown at labyrinth.net> Subject: Anybody have a recipe that clones Corona? Hello, I bottle with Corona bottles and now that I am brewing would like to try and make a Corona like beer. I have checked various recipe books and could not find any recipe that mentions a clone of Corona. I am interrested in serious replies, not mammilian, reptilian, etc excretions. Yes I did get a chuckle out of that Corona joke last week. Thanks Doug Brown - -- -------------------------------------------------------- / J. Doug Brown Sr. Software Engineer \ < jbrown at labyrinth.net jbrown at ewa.com > \ http://www.labs.net/jbrown http://www.ewa.com / -------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 09:33:10 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: metric Bill Wright <AKGOURMET at aol.com> asked >how many ounces of liquid are in 19 feet of 1/2" tubing? and earlier "Phil Yates" <yates at flexgate.infoflex.com.au> had written: > why you guys didn't >go metric years ago is beyond me It does make you wonder. That would be so much easier in metric. Pi*r^2*l, all in metric units. It would come out directly in volume units. In English units you have to know there are 231 in^3 /gallon (128 oz), or 1.8 in^3/oz. So since there are 228 inches in 19 feet, [(228 in)*(3.14)*(.25)^2] / 1.8 = ~25 fl. oz. Jeff -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 09:53:10 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: Re: Ruddles Best Bitter and Stone's Best Bitter >"Roy E. Dawson" <dawsonandassociates at on.aibn.com> writes: >I am trying to brew facsimilies of Ruddles Best Bitter, and Stone's Best >Bitter. Can anyone advise me: 1) what causes the uniqueness of their >flavour, as compared to other English bitters; 2) what types of malt, >hops, and yeast do they use. The CAMRA _Real Ale Almanac_, by Roger Protz (5th ed. 1977, ISBN 1-897784-67-8) is a great resource for this kind of quest. Some breweries are very explicit in what they reported, others less so. "Ruddles Best Bitter OG 1037 ABV 3.7% Ingredients: Halcyon pale malt (90%), crystal (1%), special brewing syrup (9%). 26 units color. Bramling Cross, Northdown, Fuggles and Goldings 91% whole hops; 9% Northdown hop pellets. 35 units of bitterness." Stone's Best Bitter (brewed by Bass in Sheffield): "OG 1038, ABV 4.1% Ingredients: cask ale malt, high maltose syrup. 13 units of color. Challenger hops for bitterness, Goldings and Progress for aroma. All whole hops. 28 units of bitterness." The fact that Stones has more alcohol than Ruddles for nearly the same OG means it is more attenuated, suggesting that the syrup is more fermentable than Ruddles. In either case, the yeast will be of critical importance for "the uniqueness of their flavour." I don't know if anyone has either brewery's yeast available. Water treatment might be of some lesser importance. Jeff -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 07:28:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Abene <skotrat at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: (Some Guy) and the 2000 AHA Home Brewers' Conference just a side note... I was contacted today by the law office of Rookum, Steelem and Robbum. They said that they were hired by someone Named Apache Unix from the HBD.ORG group. They offered me a large cash amount to play the role of a Mister Pat Babcock at the 2000 AHA Home Brewers' Conference. Hmmmm interesting... C'ya! -Scott Abene === ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT Scott Abene <skotrat at mediaone.net> http://skotrat.dynip.com/skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page) "This Space Currently for Rent... Inquire within" _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 09:42:19 -0500 From: Pvrozanski at ra.rockwell.com Subject: Re: Outside Burners You hit the nail on the head as far as the advantages and disadvantages go. I ended up buying both types because of this. I bought my 200.000btu Kajun Kooker first. I does a great job boiling water, and yes it does sound like a 747, but it provides very uneven heat for mashing or boiling wort. I paid around $48 for it. It brings 5 gallons to a boil in 15 minutes or less. Recently I bought a low pressure cooker for boiling wort. It's 36,000btu and ran me about $40. It has a cast iron burner which distributes the heat very evenly and provides a good rolling boil. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 11:22:46 -0400 (EDT) From: ALAN KEITH MEEKER <ameeker at welch.jhu.edu> Subject: offensive remarks/ mag stirrers/ yellow hops/ water pH (fwd) - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Subject: offensive remarks/ mag stirrers/ yellow hops/ water pH John Wilkins recently wrote: >>>Subject: seriousness >>>Some of us need to lighten up a bit. After all, it is beer, not life and >>>death. >>>John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas John, I realize that the dialog on the HBD of late has approached Jerry Springer levels but that is no call for such OUTRAGEOUS statements such as yours! __________________________________________________________________________ I've been using a mag stirrer this year for starters (and a barleywine!) and am never going back. My starters now grow MUCH better - probably due to the combined effects of aeration, constant rousing/mixing, and better elimination of CO2. For a cap, I simply use a clean piece of aluminum foil very lightly covering the mouth of the vessel. Go for larger surface:volume ratio for max aeration. A volume of 1 liter of rich media grown to saturation should give an adequate pitch for a 5 gallon ale volume (although Ray daniels and others have pointed out that this may be as much as 10X lower pitch rate compared to commercial rates). ___________________________________________________________________________ Yellow hop leaves: was just browsing a book on growing hops at my local megalo-book seller last night. In the troubleshooting section they stated that if the symptom is yellowing of the LOWER leaves of the plant then a Magnesium deficiency is indicated. ____________________________________________________________________________ Water pH - the thread that wouldn't die!! At the risk of spurring on more vituperative attacks between the chemical contingent here's some more water data to ponder: Last year I did some quickie expts on water pH. This was a time when topics like Ca treatments and boiling to eliminate carbonate were being discussed. Opinions seemed a bit mixed, as did recommendations in some of the better known (at least to me anyway) brewing texts. For instance, some references claimed that merely boiling water before brewing with it would lower the pH. Other sources stated that a certain amount of calcium would have to be present in the water before boiling to eliminate carbonate and thus achieve a lowering of the pH. In addition, many people/sources have advocated the addition of some type of calcium containing salt to help bring about proper pH (aside from the calcium benefit to the yeast and mashing amylases). The thread lately has focused more on the interactions between calcium and phosphate(s) in the mash but the carbonate issue still merits consideration. At any rate, after becoming confused by conflicting reports I did a little science to try to straighten things out for myself (the value of using the scientific method in brewing). A brief summary of what I found: 1) Merely boiling tap water (Baltimore tap water - pretty typical ionic profile, can post if anyone's interested...) then allowing it to cool to room temp RAISED the pH by 1 pH unit. I believe this is most likely due to the degassing that occurs with boiling, therefore loss of CO2 which is in equilibrium with carbonic acid/carbonate shifting the equilibrium. Indeed, upon stirring the pH slowly equilibrated back to the starting pH (BUT, this took SEVERAL HOURS!) 2) Merely treating with CaSO4 (gypsum) did not change the pH significantly. Subsequent boiling of this water RAISED the pH but only by 0.5 - 0.7 pH units instead of 1 pH unit and there was now a brownish precipitate (presumably CaCO3) formed. Again, following stirring to aerate, the water's pH approached the starting value over a period of several hours. When I got these results I changed my water prep protocol. Before this I would add about 5 grams or so CaSO4/5 gal water then boil thinking I was accomplishing two goals - one, the elimination of chlorine and two, elimination of carbonate to bring down the pH for mashing/sparging. My pilot experiments indicated that, with respect to water pH, I was doing just the opposite of what I'd intended! Knowing what I do now this isn't really a problem as far as the mash goes - as we've been discussing recently the mash pH can pretty well set itself and this is apparently linked in some way to the presence of phosphate from the barley (though the reactions are still a bit unclear to me and the role of the phytase/phytate reaction seems to be getting short shrift). It was the SPARGE that most concerned me. The way I was doing it I was actually sparging with ALKALINE water (pH in the range of 8.5 - 9.0!!) which, as we all know, dogma states is a big no-no. So, my current regime is to make Ca additions (though I now use CaCl2 because all the talk of possible harsh hop character due to sulphate had me losing sleep), boil (primarily to eliminate chlorine and get water temp up for mashing/sparging) then acidify to pH = 5.5-5.6 with Lactic Acid. When I've checked my mash the pH is bang on at about 5.3-5.4 and my sparge stays below 6.0 all the way through so I'm now a happy camper. (An aside, Saw Fix & Fix's recent book and in it they show a steep decrease of amylase activity on one side of the pH curve but this is exactly the opposite of the behavior seen in lab analysis of the purified enzyme, anyone know what's up with that?) ----------------- THE SKINNY: It appears that if you are counting on Ca additions + boiling to lower your water pH it aint happening, especially if you are using the water right away. Probably not a big concern in the mash but look out for that sparge! ----------------- -Alan Meeker Baltimore, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 08:38:14 -0700 From: Jeremy Bergsman <jeremybb at leland.Stanford.EDU> Subject: Jethro's volume of diacetyl > From: Joe Rolfe <onbc at shore.net> > Subject: Is it just me....or > > is Jethros "reports" always unreadibly formatted....? It's not just you, nor is it just Jethro. Please people: don't use tabs, check whether your mailer automatically wraps text after you've formatted it, and *please* use a fixed-width font for tables. ******************************************************************** > From: AKGOURMET at aol.com > Subject: HERMS Piping > Here's a question for the collective: what's the formula for figuring the > volume of a cylinder in fluid ounces ? or to be more specific, how many > ounces of liquid are in 19 feet of 1/2" tubing? The volume of a cylinder (like any right shape) is the area of its end times its length, in this case L X (radius^2) X pi. 19' X 12 in/ft X .25"^2 X pi = 44.8 cubic inches I can only do the volume conversion in metric: 44.8 X 2.54^3 = 734 cc = 24.8 oz. ******************************************************************** > From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com> > Subject: diacetyl mouthfeel > > Dave Kerr asks if diacetyl could be responsible for an oily mouthfeel in > a pFramboise. Diacetyl is often described as having a "slick" mouthfeel > but I have never experienced that even with the high levels I've > experimented with. How about other people? I experience slickness from high diacetyl in doctored beers, but only about 1/4 people in such tastings seem to perceive it that way. These people (like me) tend to have somewhat higher thresholds for the butter taste. This is a QDA as I don't record these things quantitatively, but it has held true through one tasting after I formulated the hypothesis. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:35:04 -0400 From: RobertJ <pbsys at pbsbeer.com> Subject: Re: HERMS Piping Bill Wright asks: Here's a question for the collective: what's the formula for figuring the volume of a cylinder in fluid ounces ? or to be more specific, how many ounces of liquid are in 19 feet of 1/2" tubing? ____ About 3 cups. .25" X .25" X 3.14 X 12" X 19' = 44.75 cubic inches X .017316 (ci/qt) = .775 qts or 24.8 oz. Or if you don't know the length of the coil, just fill it with water, allow to drain & measure how much is collected Bob Precision Brewing Systems URL http://www.pbsbeer.com Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 09:34:56 -0700 From: "Mercer, David" <dmercer at path.org> Subject: Magnetic stirrers Seeing as there have been several posts asking questions about magnetic stirrers, I'll jump in with my observations. I have been using a stirrer for about two years. This has been one of the most significant improvements I have made to my brewing routine since moving to all-grain. I typically build a starter using a 10P wort (made from DME) boiled in an Erlenmeyer flask. Originally I sealed the top of the flask with a wad of cotton and an aluminum foil cover when I boiled, but lately I've been leaving out the cotton and just using a foil cover that extends down 2-3 inches from the top of the flask. I oxygenate all my starter worts using O2 and a SS airstone (never had a problem with infections that I know of) and use an airlock with a #9 or #10 stopper depending on the flask size. I start stirring immediately upon pitching. During the first 6 hours or so I figure the constant stirring continually feeds more oxygen to the yeast from the O2 rich air inside the airlocked-sealed flask. After that it serves more to drive CO2 out of the starter and keep the yeast in suspension. Generally, I can build up to a 1.5L starter in a 2L flask* and, if necessary, feed that more than once if I want even more slurry. I keep the stirrer going at a moderate speed (enough to create a gentle whirlpool) and when I'm bored I rev it up every now and then just to watch the fireworks in the airlock as vodka goes spewing out the little hole on the plastic cap. I don't stop stirring until the starter has fermented out and I want the slurry to settle (usually about 3 days after pitching). In my experience, using a stirrer and well-oxygenated wort produces prodigious amounts of yeast. *The quantity of wort is yeast-dependent. If using a stirrer, do NOT try to ferment 1.5L of wort in a 2L flask when using 3068 (Weihenstephan) yeast or you will have a monumental mess the next day. Trust me on this. Even 1 liter in a 2 liter flask needs to be watched carefully. Other yeast strains seem to behave with a little more civility. Return to table of contents
Date: 17 May 1999 09:41:27 -0700 From: Jeffry D Luck <Jeffry.D.Luck at aexp.com> Subject: It's the water...? I have a water question for you all. First off, I barely passed 1st quarter chemistry back at the 'U, and that was 20 years ago. So I usually see posts about calcium & phospherates and just page down. If this question has been answered recently in HBD, I apologise for not noticing. So here goes.... I usually boil my water the evening before brew-day. When it just starts to boil, it's clear, but after 5 minutes or so, it looks cloudy, as if I threw in an ounce or two of milk. In the morning after the water has cooled, it's clear again, but as I pour it into the primary, there is some white sludge (notice my command of chemical jargon here) at the bottom of my holding tank. Having reached the conclusion that it looks yucky and therefore shouldn't go into my beer, I've congratulated myself for pouring off 'clean' water. (Don't snicker.) Can anyone tell me what I've been so conciensously avoiding in my brew? Am I doing right to avoid the sludge or am I missing some critical element? My beer tastes great, so I'm not too concerned about this, just curious. BTW, The water here is pretty hard, but not so's you can taste it. Or at least I can't. Jeff Luck Salt Lake City, UT - USA Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:11:44 -0500 (CDT) From: Thomas S Barnett <barnets at mail.auburn.edu> Subject: False Bottom Hello all, My current brewing system employs a 15 gallon polarware pot with a 10 gallon Gott cooler. Generally, i'll mix the water and grains in the pot, bring to the desired temp. and transfer to the Gott cooler for the main rest and sparging. This system is very convenient for step mash and/or decoction procedures. However, i'm hoping to simplify it a bit by avoiding the transfer(s) to the Gott cooler. With this in mind, i've been considering a SS false bottom that fits directly in the pot. Does anyone have any experience with these? Any problems with stuck sparges? Can step mashes still be done by adding heat, (via a propane source), directly to the kettle, or is this false bottom intended for infusion mashing? Thanks. Tom barnett. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 10:08:20 From: Andrew Marsh <amarsh at gmcl.bc.ca> Subject: Burners A few questions on burners. I'm just starting to put together a system using converted kegs for kettles. I would like to get some opinions on the type/make of burner and power output that is best suited for keg type kettles. The burners I have found range from 50 000 to 200 000 BTU and come in various configurations from a complete unit with legs to just a cast iron burner from a hot water heater. I like the price of just the burner but may not be such a bargain after I buy the regulator, hose, make the stand, etc. I would eventually like to have 2 or more burners to avoid moving the kettles around so is a fabricated steel frame with hot water tank burners somehow mounted a good system or are the complete units worth the extra cost? Is 200 000 BTU's good to have or is it overkill and a waste of propane? If the complete unit with legs are the way to go, any particular make? I would like to try and find a Canadian supplier as ordering would be easier without duty and exchange rates to mess around with. Any info would be appreciated. Private email OK. Andrew Marsh Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:24:02 -0500 From: John.Wilkinson at aud.alcatel.com (John Wilkinson) Subject: Beer laws Steve Alexander writes of Ohio beer laws: >What category of idiocy (or is it >greed?) is needed in order to create such a convoluted complex and >contradictory set of rules which in total appear to impose no purposeful >order.? I was in South Carolina recently and noticed that liquor stores seemed to be only marked ABC, giving no hint as to their purpose. Somehow, instinctively I guess, I thought these were liquor stores. Actually, someone had probably told me some time ago. Anyway, these liquor stores were not allowed to sell beer, only liquor and wine. I mentioned to the guy running one that they weren't the only odd ones, in Oklahoma liquor stores could sell wine but not corkscrews. The guy in S.C said they couldn't either. He could sell only liquor and wine, no magazines, corkscrews, mixers, or anything else. And in London the pubs I am familiar with have to close in the middle of the afternoon. But a guest at a hotel can drink there 24 hours. There were even beer vending machines in the hall in one place I stayed. Of course, I could really burn up some bandwidth describing screwey alcohol laws here in Texas. I have about convinced my self that there is an international conspiricy to screw up alcohol laws. And people are wasting their time worrying about the Tri-lateral Commission, or whatever it is, when there is a really dangerous conspiricy afoot! Maybe there should be a John Booze Society to publicize this. John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:29:16 -0500 From: John.Wilkinson at aud.alcatel.com (John Wilkinson) Subject: HBD Bouncer? Fred L. Johnson write: >Since some folks in this place simply refuse to excercise restraint on their >public behavior, perhaps it is time that the HBD hired a bouncer. Uh oh, I don't like the direction this is taking. Pat as Big Brother? Don't say Steve Alexander didn't warn you. John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 10:45:34 -0700 (PDT) From: beanish at blarg.net Subject: Pickled Hop Shoots Jethro Gump gave a glowing review of the pickled hop shoots from Puterbaugh Farms in a recent hbd. As a happy customer with no affiliation blah blah blah, I have to mention that Puterbaugh farms is on the web at http://www.hopsdirect.com/ We've been lucky enough to have the folks from Puterbaugh Farms come to the St Patrick's Cascadia Cup homebrew competition that my homebrew club (Cascade Brewers Guild, eastside Seattle) sponsors every March. They set up a nice display, with hop vines, bales of loose hops, samples of pickled hops, etc. We do put them on the other side of the room from the judging, so that we don't find everything from cider to IPA to have a fresh, floral hops aroma! - -- Jeremy York beanish at blarg.net Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:54:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Murman <smurman at best.com> Subject: stirring ?= aeration Several recent posts have commented about stir plates. Just how much O2 diffusion occurs when stirring? My intuition tells me it's negligible compared with forcing O2 into solution. Stirring rouses the yeast and forces excess CO2 out of solution, both of which cause foaming, but I think you still need to perform oxygenation with some other means. The idea is to have 100% saturation when the yeast want to bud. We start with 0% since our wort has been pre-boiled by some means. I don't think stirring can quickly raise from 0% to 100%, and I doubt it could make an appreciable dent even over time. -SM- Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:33:34 -0500 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: Dialectic corrosion between SS/Copper/Alu? Hi there folks, I've got a 17 US gallon Alu pot that I want to put a spigot into. Do I have to worry about dialectic corrosion between SS/Copper/Alu? I'm looking at a copper ball valve, and either copper or SS washers. If it is a problem, what other options do I have? thanks, -alan - -- Alan McKay OS Support amckay at nortelnetworks.com Small Site Integration 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) Nortel Networks Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:23:51 -0500 From: rlabor at lsumc.edu (LaBorde, Ronald) Subject: RE: HERMS Piping >From: AKGOURMET at aol.com >Here's a question for the collective: what's the formula for figuring the >volume of a cylinder in fluid ounces ? or to be more specific, how many >ounces of liquid are in 19 feet of 1/2" tubing? I'm too lazy to calculate that, besides what about the curvature of the coil, and what about dents and surface irregularities, etc. We do not want to worry the burley brewer with all this do we?? I would just measure out an exact gallon, then carefully fill the entire coil, then measure what is missing from the gallon. The flexible tubing you mentioned sounds like it's working alright for you. I used rigid copper pipe for the input side of the pump, and used a short piece of flexible tubing and cable clamps as couplings. This allows about a 1/4 inch or so piece of flexible tubing subject to any low pressure or vacuum forces. The flexibility allows stresses on the pump housing to be relieved, but the very small amount of tubing eliminates any problems with suction collapse. This is also a very easy and cheap way to get your couplings. I think my HLT exchanger coil is about 15 foot long. I have noticed that if I rock the coil, the heat exchange goes much faster, same effect as when one rocks the immersion chiller. I setup a pump to circulate the hot liquor around the coil and things went better also, but I wonder if that will cause HSA in the hot liquor. Ron Ronald La Borde - Metairie, Louisiana - rlabor at lsumc.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:42:46 -0500 (CDT) From: BrewInfo <brewinfo at xnet.com> Subject: Compatible with hops Bill just planted hops and asks what plants might be compatible with them. I suggest coriander/cilantro. Don't bother buying seeds (too expensive)... just buy some bulk coriander and plant that. There are three benefits to planting coriander/cilantro next to the hops: 1. the tiny flowers of the cilantro/coriander plants provide hiding places for beneficial insects, 2. the cilantro can be used for making salsa, which goes well with beer, and 3. you can brew with the coriander when it finally goes to seed. Dry the seeds well and don't use them for several months (using too-young coriander gives a rubbery aroma/flavour). Al. Al Korzonas, Lockport, IL korz at brewinfo.com http://www.brewinfo.com/brewinfo/ Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 21:44:13 +0000 From: William Frazier <billfrazier at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Bottling The beer from the keg is always better than the bottled version of the same recipe, even from the same batch. Must be something about the secondary fermentation products that build up during conditioning. So, since I like to have some bottled beer on hand I'm going to start filling by the counterpressure method. Hopefully, the bottled beer will taste as good as the keg version. I would appreciate input on the various types/brands of counterpressure filling equipment and any tips on filling by this method. TIA. Bill Frazier Johnson County, Kansas Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 18:10:27 -0500 From: John.Wilkinson at aud.alcatel.com (John Wilkinson) Subject: RE: Is it just me....or Joe Rolfe wrote: >is Jethros "reports" always unreadibly formatted....? Me to, Joe. I seem to get it O.K. viewed on line but if printed the lines are too long and words are lost. I don't know why that would be because HBD always rejects my posts if lines are too long. John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:39:34 +1000 From: "Phil and Jill Yates" <yates at flexgate.infoflex.com.au> Subject: Cats, Skunks and still more Cats! Nathan Kanous could just be onto something here. Yes it's true, we don't have native skunks here in Australia (by the way, that's pronounced " horse trailer"). The closest we ever got to one was watching Pepe La Pooh (does anyone remember the proper spelling?) on the Bugs Bunny show. Strangely enough, he had a bit of a thing about cats himself! Oh yes, and Don McLean once sang about one he saw in the middle of the road, and Doctor Pivo must have been in the car right behind Don as he has a photo of it. But that really is another story. Nathan, I was trying to be somewhat polite when discussing the Mexican beer. A more uncouth person than myself ( like Fouthey for example) would have come straight out and called it "cat's piss"! I would appreciate you sending me over a bottle of skunky aroma ( is it expensive ?) but I doubt if it will match the flavour profile I was discussing. Please be sure to send in a dark bottle to avoid the possibility of a light struck aroma upon opening at this end. That would be all too confusing!!! Cheers Phil Yates. Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 22:08:37 -0700 From: Scott Johnson <JaScJohnson at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Beer Festival Our homebrew club the Hillbilly Hoppers would like to invite everyone to a beer festival. We have been invited to participate in the festival and would like to have you stop by and try some of our beers. The beer festival is the: The first annual Governor's Crossing Brewers' Festival Date : June 26, 1999 Where : Rocky River Brewing Company in Sevierville, Tennessee. There are to be a minimum of 20 craft breweries from seven states, six food vendors serving everything from Mexican to German, two live bands, a radio broadcast from the site. Admission for this 8 hour beer extravaganza is only $20 per taster and $5 for designated drivers, who get free non-alcoholic beverages, but no beer. Cheers, Scott Johnson Hillbilly Hoppers Homebrew Club Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 03:47:00 +0000 From: William Frazier <billfrazier at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Cats Brad McMahon writes..., An Australian who has never swung a cat by the tail. (You grab them by the neck, snake style, so they can't turn and bite.) Brad...you obviously don't live with a male cat. I had an old tom (The Puskin) that was involved in many cat wars in the years he lived with me. As soon as the girls in my family heard the cat "singing" begin, I would have to go out and track down The Puskin. Once I found him I would have to sneak up behind, instantly grab him beneath the shoulders with an iron grip, hold him at arms length until I got him home. Only then could I safely (for my sake) release him. This cat was so mean he would turn on me or any other living thing that happened to be in his territory, if the mood struck him. Still, I loved that old beast, even after all these years. He died of excessive alcohol consumption and smoking related disease. Bill Frazier Johnson County, Kansas Return to table of contents
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