HOMEBREW Digest #3196 Thu 16 December 1999

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  +  We Mail and Host Christmas Special + (justgoodnews)
  Budweiser Budvar, HSA, Millennium ("Ken Schramm")
  DoppleBock, sparging and attenuation ("Mr. Joy Hansen")
  Hugh Baird? Try Beestons Maris Otter (Jim Cave)
  Propane in basement (kathy/jim)
  Qxygen Barrier Bags for "Cask" Ale ("Brett A. Spivy")
  diets (kathy/jim)
  thoughts on a rims (J Daoust)
  Brew shops or Clubs ("Stephen Jordan")
  RIMS stuff ("Steve Phillips")
  cooppers SA ("Darren Robey")
  Re: Lunacy (Spencer W Thomas)
  Attenuation (Spencer W Thomas)
  Re: Atkins Diet (phil sides jr)
  Incomplete Starch Conversion ("John Herman")
  RE: Cask ale in a corny ("Sherfey")
  Scaling up/head retention/type of brewer ("John Stegenga")
  Comments on bad batch? ("Dan Senne")
  Livin' in da UP (Nathan Kanous)
  re: installing valve in aluminum kettle (John_E_Schnupp)
  Carbs and barbs ("Alan Meeker")
  Re; Head Retention; Cask Breathers ("Gary Barbatelli")
  Re: Lunacy ("Dic Gleason")
  Re: Scaling Up - The Next Step? (Spencer W Thomas)
  Re: Calories/PID (Spencer W Thomas)
  Music to drink Pils by (Jeff Renner)
  scaling up/homebrew shop (MVachow)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 14 Dec 99 03:45:51 EST From: justgoodnews at excite.com Subject: + We Mail and Host Christmas Special + Direct Email is the most powerful and least expensive method of online advertising. Why not introduce your business to thousands of potential customers now? With benefits such as massive instant exposure and measurable results, a medium that excels at generating immediate cash is central to any business. DO YOU NEED MORE THAN 3 HITS A DAY? If you're tired of getting three hits a day (Which is what the average web site gets!) and you've been waiting for the key opportunity to tell people about your offer, this is the one! HAVE YOUR PRODUCT OR SERVICE BLASTED TO THOUSANDS! We will send your advertisement by itself to over 100k + responsive email addresses, many of whom are proven buyers! You won't find a more responsive list anywhere! Most list members are small business owners, webmasters, and business opportunity seekers. ************************************************** DON'T WAIT! - GET THE DETAILS NOW! Just Call US at (888) 341-4786 ************************************************** *** SALE FOR CHRISTMASS *** All specials are with 10 Megs Web Hosting On Bulk Server For One Month,FREE Remove Phone Number,and Free Domain registration. Special 1-A 2 Million General U.S. Mailing $999.75 Per Month $175.00 Setup Special 1-B 5 Million General U.S. Mailing $1999.75 Per Month $150.00 Setup Special 1-C 15.4 Million General U.S. Mailing $4999.75 Per Month $99.00 Setup Special 2-A 50k Targeted Mailing $999.75 Per Month $175.00 Setup Special 2-B 200k Targeted Mailing $1999.75 Per Month $145.00 Setup Special 3-A 500k Targeted AOL Mailing $2999.75 Per Month $175.00 Setup Special 3-B 1 Million Targeted AOL Mailing $4499.99 Per Month $199.00 Setup ************************************************** Order now and save! (Some of our competitors charge from 20 to 25 cents per name just for mailing!) You figure the savings and count the tremendous benefits! This powerful marketing weapon could help you succeed online and automatically sell more, quickly and easily. For more infomation on adult,cassino,targeted.etc. Please just give us a call. (888) 341-4786 LISTEN TO WHAT OUR CUSTOMERS SAY! ************************************************** "Our 1st mailing was a huge success!!!! Thanks..." - Barbara Krafchik ************************************************** "Thank You! Upon you broadcasting my advertising today, I have so far today received 171 responses and most likely will receive even more responses before the day is over. I'm pleased, and will tell others about your service." - James Starcevic ************************************************** "...The best results I have ever gotten from any advertisement that I have paid for. Thank you very much..." - Richard Harris ************************************************** You're receiving this email because you're on the same Safe List or a Web Mail 4 Less Member and thus have agreed to receive offers via email from our advertisers. You may cancel your membership at: (888) 341-4786 Clearly spell your email address and you will be removed. Thank You For Your Support. ************************************************** winner-1 Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 13:14:54 -0600 From: Kim.Hansen at state.sd.us Subject: RAY DANIELS TO EDIT NEW BREWER, ZYMURGY Hello fellow brewers! I just got this news article from the Real Beer Page Monthly News Digest. Can anyone provide any info on Ray, and do you think he will make a big difference in the format of Zymurgy? I've been thinking of joining HBA and subscribing to Zymurgy, but from the mixed reviews I have read on HBD, I am at a standstill. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated! - -------------------------- RAY DANIELS TO EDIT NEW BREWER, ZYMURGY Ray Daniels has taken the job as editor-in-chief of The New Brewer and Zymurgy magazines. Amahl Turczyn will join Daniels as the associate editor of both publications. Daniels wears many hats in the beer world. He is an award-winning home brewer, was 1998 Beer Writer of the Year (he's written three books and is a frequent contributor to several periodicals), is an active member of the Chicago Beer Society and organizer of the Real Ale Festival in Chicago. - -------------------------- Kim -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Kim Hansen Telecommunications State of South Dakota Kim.Hansen at state.sd.us -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 14:18:28 -0500 From: "Ken Schramm" <schramk at resa.net> Subject: Budweiser Budvar, HSA, Millennium After reading about the availability of the Budvar undermodified malt, I saw, but did not hear, a report about Budvar on CNN (I was standing in line at the bank and they don't turn up the sound on their monitor). I noticed that they were using the Budweiser name, and not just simply Budweis as I has previously seen while in Europe. Did they win some court battle or just go off and do this? Either way, it was a delight to see. If you heard the audio, could you please fill me in? I got nicked for two things before I went into work related hibernation a month or so ago: First was the possibiliy of HSA when racking hot wort onto fruit in a plastic fermenter. Yes, if you just splashed it onto the fruit, there would be cause for concern. My boil tun valves are reduced down to 5/8 OD stainless steel pipe, and with a piece of 5/8 ID food grade plastic tubing slipped over that, extending down into the plastic fermenter, I can run the hot wort off as quietly and splash free as a pass through a counterflow. With the exception of doubling the exposed surface area in the pot and fermenter, I don't see (or taste) any real problem. On the millennium front: I just replaced a bunch of computer equipment to avoid the millennium bug, so it seems like a millennium to me. I know it won't really be the millennium until 2001, but when I turned 10, I started my second decade, and when I turn 100, I'll start my second century, so I am going to keep right on going with the "best homebrew party of the new millennium" bit. Even the theologians don't go so far as to think that we got the date right without any room for possible error, so I'm going to party twice. Count me in the "yeah, I know, but I just don't give a ^%$#" category. I am looking for clubs to step up to host a 2 hour time slot in the Hospitality suite at the AHA convention in June. Bring beer (or mead or cider), info on the beer, and whatever soak-up type munchies you care to provide. Please contact me privately. The AHA2K convention sounds like it will be a great time. The presenters list keeps getting longer and more esteemed. Peter Blum, formerly of Stroh's and still the family historian, has agreed to present. He is a treasure trove of information, stories, and Dan McConnell said he nailed malt by variety, region of state and date of harvest by blind-tasting a handful. It dropped Dan's jaw. If you can do that, you should be presenting, too. I want to reiterate that those who want the AHA to provide better services, and to better match their profile of an NPO representative of their interests, should attend and spend some time dealing with those points. The AHA and its members need to begin thinking about their organization as a member-driven organization, in which the members both determine AND work to achieve the organization's goals. If we are to succeed and prosper like other hobby or interest based member organizations, we need to start the process of decentralizing those roles, and there can be no better place to get that ball rolling than at the convention. 192 days until the Best Homebrew Party of the new Millenium Yours, Ken Schramm Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 09:32:20 -0500 From: "Mr. Joy Hansen" <joytbrew at patriot.net> Subject: DoppleBock, sparging and attenuation Hi Charles, Your question about sparging will most likely remain unanswered with this response. However, I wanted to let you know that I use the mentioned sparge technique with my RIMS and it works! I gravity recirculate the run off liquor until it's as clear as possible and then move the liquor to the boil pot by pumping or pouring. I call it a pseudo sparge. I don't do it to get great extractions. I do it because I have mechanized stirring in addition to RIMS recirculation. This system reaches the desired temperature gets the extraction done quickly and effortlessly. Joy"T"Brew Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 11:53:36 -0800 From: Jim Cave <cave at psc.org> Subject: Hugh Baird? Try Beestons Maris Otter There was a comment about Hugh Baird malt disappearing from the North American scene. If you have a chance, try Beeston's Maris Otter. You won't go back: 10% higher yield, 100% better flavour and clarity. Jim Cave Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 15:37:55 -0400 From: kathy/jim <kbooth at scnc.waverly.k12.mi.us> Subject: Propane in basement Hope folks noticed the article about the Michigan citizen dutifully preparing for Y2K, stored propane in his basement and blew away his house. This issue has been discussed ad naseum in previous HBD's, but, did we really take the hazard seriously? cheers, jim booth Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 15:15:40 -0600 From: "Brett A. Spivy" <baspivy at softdisk.com> Subject: Qxygen Barrier Bags for "Cask" Ale On 12/14/1999 "Philip J Wilcox" <pjwilcox at cmsenergy.com> wrote: <snip> Hey Jack here is a product opportunity. How about an oxygen barrier corney bladder? A corney volumed bag with a hard plastic tube you insert up the air line from inside the keg, the bag is fed through the plastic tube and then inverted over the threads of the keg. Then a mini dip-tube . . . <snip> Why not just use the Bag in a Box System? Many wine making suppliers sell a 4L and 18L aluminized mylar bag with a circular hard plastic (polyethylene ?!?) ring affixed in the bottom corner so that you fill, then snap on a soft (like the material playtex nipples (Fouch! -SHHHH!!) are made of) rubber spout. These bags are rated at 15 psi because the California table wine industry positively charges them to 8 psi with nitrogen prior to filling. you could fill with your favorite "real" ale, primed to your desired level, cellar at you accustomed temperature, then slide the (now somewhat bloated bag) into your dispensing box and Viola! Cask conditioned ale. <doe-eyed, naive, idea-man mode off/> <flameproofed cynical, heard-it-all mode on> Brett A. Spivy Stolen Cactus Brewery Shreveport, LA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 16:28:43 -0400 From: kathy/jim <kbooth at scnc.waverly.k12.mi.us> Subject: diets >From 50 years or so of fighting the fat body battle, I conclude: As I remember, carbohydrates have 4 cals/g, fats 9 cal/gm and ETOH provides something like 6 cal/gm , somewhere inbetween. Low carbohydrate diets do work to make people lose weight. They basically throw the body into ketosis and cause it to lose water. Ketosis makes you feel poorly so you don't eat, have much energy, feel like accomplishing anything or doing sustained accomplishments. YMMV Doctors do not like to make people sick, so they advise against throwing your body into ketosis to lose weight. Successful dieters on low carb diets, manage to control their calorie intake to levels needed to dump the pounds. Feeling poorly due to ketosis helps limit calorie intake. Exercise both burns calories and builds muscle mass. Body weight in muscle mass has a higher basal metabolism than fat, plus it makes all sorts of activity easier to sustain. Result....calories get burned. As someone who has been fat and not so fat at different times, I can attest that fewer calories and more exercise is at the heart of a lifestyle need to stay trim. The French, Italians, etc are getting fatter as they adjust to modern life. Europeans don't serve large servings and have seconds like the good old USA. For me to be trim, I need to focus on things other than food and drink, whether it is eating and drinking or not eating and drinking. When one fills one's life with thots of what one is eating or dieting and not eating, one will be hungry, and I'll put on weight. One trying to lose weight will usually be hungry unless one is preoccupied by something else as graduate studies, coping with a mind consuming event, building RIMS, etc. (note beer related). A food diary that tells us when we've filled our fuel tank with the calories our activity requires to sustain our bodies, is the only way a fatty like myself can know when enuf is enuf. My appetite cannot\ be trusted. When I was a runner and a brewer, the runner meetings had more boney asses than the brewer meetings. Most skinny runners eat carbs rather than low carb diets. If I'm so wise, why ain't I trim? It tastes so good and I don't mean Budmillercoors. cheers, jim booth PS...Has anyone else tried the Munich Recipe Lowenbrau being imported to MI by LaBatt? Interested in your comments. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 14:07:26 -0800 From: J Daoust <thedaousts at ixpres.com> Subject: thoughts on a rims ok,all this talk on using a rims has re-fueled my need? ok want for one. It would seem if I was to use a vessel containing the heater element, a coil of 1/2" copper for the wort, and some sort of medium, I could have a heat exchanger that would heat the wort to a specified temp without scorching or overheating. I am thinking of placing one thermostat on the vessel to control the heating temp, and run the pump for the entire length of the mash to keep the temp even. I am doing the mash in a 10 gal water cooler, so it retains the heat very well already. With my system the way it is now, I only have to reheat the batch maybe twice in 90 minutes. Any ideas, thoughts, welcome, Jerry Daoust Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 17:19:43 -0500 From: "Stephen Jordan" <Carrotbay at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Brew shops or Clubs Anybody out there know of any homebrew clubs or homebrew shops in the Charlottesville Va. area. Thanks SRJ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 18:10:57 -0600 From: "Steve Phillips" <swp at spcinc-usa.com> Subject: RIMS stuff Howdy... Ron wonders how to test the temperature of the mash with a rims system. Simply place the thermometer probe in front of the pump with a "T" connection (you've brewed on the Possum Trot Brewery, Ron). Drawing from the return, you've got the best possible reading of average mash temperature. I tried placing the probe into the center of the mash, but I was disappointed with the results after putting a glass floating thermometer into the top of the mash. Of course without gobs of laborious stirring there will be differences in the temperature of the mash tun as a whole, but measuring the temp at the source of draw from the tun should be pretty foolproof as to how much heat has to be added to the wort. I built a Rick Calley type setup with an HLT heat exchanger about three years ago, and it has served me very well. But after following the recent threads I want to add my bit to the conversation... a 25 foot coil of HVAC copper is not a very efficient way to ramp temps. I figure that if I plotted the temps over the mash it would be sort of a linear ramp instead of the "stair steps" I've been wanting. I've been searching for a source of coiled finned copper to improve the efficiency of the thermal transfer and allow me to follow the ramp schedule a bit more to plan, and might have found one in an Alabama manufacturer. Problem is they only want to do runs in thousand foot lengths. If anyone is interested in looking into purchasing a coil 15 feet in length by 12 inches in diameter (or something like this), please let me know by private e-mail and I'll follow up on the costs. Their thermal engineer is looking into what is needed and approximately how much the production run will cost per unit. Party on... Steve Phillips The Possum Trot Brewery Long Beach, MS Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 15:55:18 +1000 From: "Darren Robey" <drobey at awb.com.au> Subject: cooppers SA >for the coopers speakling ale use the franklins malt...schooner is for largers. This is directly opposite to my beliefe. Most Australian Frainklin is exported to Asia for lager brewing. Schooner and Arapiles etc are used for Australian brewing with large amounts also exported. Franklin pays a premium to growers as it is a premium lager malt. >is the criticism at using POR hops for flavouring directed at the major Australian brewers?? It wouldnt matter what hops Australian mega brews use as it is mostly used as iso extract anyhow. CUB dont use any hops in the kettle at all, but add the extract before bottling. I suspect most also do the same. I use quite a lot of POR as a bittering hop, but never bother using it for late additions as in my ohte only affect is has is to leave a harsh flavour. BTW I'm open to be proven wrong on the franklin storey, but thats what growers were told when the variety was released about 5 years ago. Darren Robey Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 01:09:57 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Re: Lunacy Paul, I hate to disappoint you, but the full moon occurs on Dec 22 at 1731UT, that is 12:31 EST. I guess if you're in Japan it happens on Dec 23. This info courtesy of the US Naval Observatory at http://aa.usno.navy.mil/AA/data/docs/MoonPhase.html#y1999 And again, according to the UNSO, the solstice is Dec 22 0744UT, or 2:44 (AM) EST. I guess if you're on the west coast, it's on the 21st by about 15 minutes. See http://aa.usno.navy.mil/AA/data/docs/EarthSeasons.html Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 01:15:59 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Attenuation ChuckM writes: I had a bottle of Salvator and measured it's gravity at about 1.016. I read that the starting gravity is about 1.075. This would lead to an apparent attenuation of about 79%. None of the available lager yeasts claim attenuations this high. The effect of yeast on attenuation is so much smaller than the effect of your mash schedule and grain bill that I really don't see the point in quoting "attenuation" as a percentage in a yeast description. Maybe saying "high," "medium," and "low" attenuation is meaningful. That gives you some information you can use. But to say that a yeast's attenuation is "70-75%" is ridiculous. I can make a wort that will attenuate to only 50% and another one that will attenuate to 90% with that SAME YEAST. (You don't believe the 90% number? I have a Belgian-style strong ale that started at 1.080 and ended at 1.008. 'Struth!) Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 02:25:39 -0500 From: phil sides jr <psides at carl.net> Subject: Re: Atkins Diet Steven Owens writes: >"Yes it is/No it's not" claims. It would be nice to see some >qualified medical person actually refute Atkins' claims instead of >waving their hands and dismissing it. You won't see it because they can't; if this were not true, it would have already happened. Dr. Atkins has been at this for about thirty years. 'Conventional medicine' as you call it has had ample time to refute his claims. Phil Sides, Jr. Concord, NH - -- Macht nicht o'zapft ist, Prost! Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 05:32:03 -0500 From: "John Herman" <johnvic at earthlink.net> Subject: Incomplete Starch Conversion I had read one famous home brewing author say that he mashes ( infusion mash ) for 30 minutes. He states that while this may not be the efficient use of grain, on a 5 gallon scale the price difference is small. Other than that, is there any problems with an incomplete starch conversion? Will it affect the flavor of my brew? John Herman johnvic at earthlink.net Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 06:11:45 -0500 From: "Sherfey" <sherf at warwick.net> Subject: RE: Cask ale in a corny After Jeff's words I'm thinking maybe I'm just lucky. With my handpump system, I crack the gas valve and shut it off maybe once a week, and if I have cracked too much and get pump bleed, I just bleed all of the gas off. It's possible (probable) that there is air sucking in there, but enough of a blanket to avoid spoilage. I keep my "cask" set-up for weeks like this without problems. I haven't paid any attention to it because no beer has soured in two years of doing this. I have a steam beer on now thats been there for four weeks. I have never moved a corny off of the handpump until it's kicked, and maybe that's a good thing.... Cheers! David Sherfey Warwick, NY Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 07:30:23 -0500 From: "John Stegenga" <bigjohns at mindspring.com> Subject: Scaling up/head retention/type of brewer Lots of interesting threads in the HBD these days, and one day this 'I'd brew every day if I could' brewer may indeed look into the RIMS idea, but for now... In HBD #3195, Steve Owens discusses 'scaling up'. This paragraph in particular scares me... > However, I'm loathe to start spending wads of cash on equipment >(a couple hundred bucks for a burner, a couple hundred bucks for a >nice, larger pot, probably need a wort chiller at this point, should >think about going all-grain) without looking at the options. Should I >just jump past that to something more elegant, not to mention maybe >easier to clean? You spend a couple hundred on a burner? What you need is something like a Camp Chef or NewBraunfells turkey cooker/smoker. Any RING TYPE burner from 100K to 150K btu. Typical off season price - $70USD. Then a larger pot. You can start with a converted keg, or with a large aluminum stock pot, depending on your price. You can get a converted keg from sources on the net for $40-150 (big range, eh?) or you can find a large 15/20 gal aluminum restaurant stock pot for 60-100. Stainless steel is also an option (some say the only one, but we'll not broach that subject), with a 15gal (actually about 14.6) 'polarware' pot running something like $180... I mash/lauter with 2 rectangular picnic coolers (Coleman). They came with drain holes and so I plumbed one with a 1/2" copper manifold. Last weekend our brew club had a brew day and we brewed 15gal of 1.060 IPA in it (30+lb of grain), and used my 80qt ALUMINUM kettle to boil it. My mash/lauter setup cost me perhaps a total of $75 including the ball valve and such. I use a stopper and a piece of racking cane (bent down to the bottom) of the sparge (hot liquor tank) cooler to pick up the sparge water. Leave about a CUP behind when I use it, so there is little water wasted. So, I'm scaled up. I can brew up to 15gal at a time (20 if I'm shooting for a smaller beer ~1.040 and don't mind topping up the fermenters), and my total costs are $75 for the 2 cooler HLT, Mash/Lauter setup, $95 for the 80qt kettle (shipped to my house), and $90 for the burner. Oh, another $30 for the 60ft 3/8" Immersion wort chiller... Now, that said - the wife preferred it when brew day was 2 hours instead of 6, but she really loves the beer so I get away with it as long as I don't try to brew EVERY week... In HBD # 3195, Carl Wilson asks: >Subject: Improving Head Retention - Use Wheat Malt or Flaked Barley? >I recall reading that to improve the head retention of your brew, that you >should add either some wheat malt or flaked barley. Is one preferable over >the other? How much should you use? I have NO problem with head, in either my extract brews, partial mashes, or all grain. My all grain batches usually include 5% carapils and my mash temps usually hit around 155. That being said, torrified wheat, wheat malt, and/or flaked barley (unmalted) can help head retention. But first make sure that the problem is not your glassware. Get a disposable plastic cup, fresh from the bag it came in, and pour in some of your beer. If the beer still has head after 5 minutes, you probably have dishwasher soap that has 'sheeting action', i.e. it coats the glasses with something that kills surface tension - like Jet Dry does. Rinse the HELL out of your glasses after they come out of the dishwasher with the hottest water you can handle. 3 or 4 vigorous rinses. then let them drip dry. Now, if that does not help your head retention problem, add 1lb wheat malt (or 6% of grist) to your beer, replacing the same amount of barley malt. Any more and the wheat flavor might be noticed. John Stegenga AKA Bigjohn Bigjohn's Basement Brew house Woodstock, GA (quite some distance south of Jeff Renner) Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 06:59:32 -0600 From: "Dan Senne" <dsenne at intertek.net> Subject: Comments on bad batch? Can anyone offer any opinions of why my latest pale ale is a major disappointment? Here are the details: Grain bill: 8 1/2 lbs. Briess 2 row 1/2 lb. Crystal 40L 1/2 lb. Carapils Mash: Rest for 15 minutes at 122F Infusion boost to 155F and rest for 60 min. Sparge for about an hour using 158F water Boil/hops: 1 oz. Perle boiled for 50 min. 1/2 oz. Cascade boiled for 45 min. 1/2 oz. Cascade boiled for 15 min. 1/2 oz. Cascade boiled for 5 min. Total boil time 60 min. S.G. was 1.050 Chilled, aerated and pitched 600ml starter of Wyeast 1056. In primary for 12 days. Transfer to secondary and dry hop with 1/2 oz. Cascade for 15 days. Forgot to take F.G. reading before bottling. After 2 weeks, it's well carbonated, but the taste is not good. I was aiming for something in between Sierra Nevada Pale Ale and Liberty Ale, but shot way wide of either one. I've had good luck with all my previous batches, and all have been quite drinkable after two 2 weeks (although they did improve with age). My other batches have all been pretty lightly hopped, usually with Mt. Hood. Do hoppier brews need to condition longer to mellow out? This was the first time I've used Perle or Cascade. I can't quite put my finger on what is wrong tastewise, but it's definately not good. I can drink a glass, but it's not very enjoyable. Wouldn't an infection render it pretty much undrinkable? Any constructive comments welcome, Dan Senne Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 07:37:40 -0600 From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu> Subject: Livin' in da UP Hi Everybody, In lieu of starting any long-winded discussions of the thermodynamic stability of mash in my tun (note the crudely placed sarcasm), I thought I'd pass along an interesting link. We've had a couple questions about pickled eggs. Some interesting approaches to making your eggs "peelable". We've also had a request or two for recipes. Now, I can remember living in Michigan's Upper Peninsula we used to joke about heading to the local watering hole for "steak and eggs" breakfast. This was just an excuse to go to a bar and eat jerky ("steak"), pickled eggs (the eggs part) and start drinking beer at ridiculous hours of the morning. Of course, this was when Leinenkugel's was "cheap beer". No joke, it was cheap and was considered the swill on campus at Michigan Tech (we more refined folks drank Stroh's). Look at Jake now, livin' high on the hog makin' Microbrew. Anyhow, back to the steak and eggs....here's a recipe site that may be useful for some of the pickled egg types out there..... http://zephyr.rice.edu/department/students/lemaux/peggs.html Oh yeah, the B&B was one of those places we could go for "steak and eggs". Later. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 05:43:30 -0800 From: John_E_Schnupp at amat.com Subject: re: installing valve in aluminum kettle patrick, >i want to install a ball valve on the 15 gal aluminum kettle i use for >boiling wort. <snip> >i've looked through the hbd archives and found one description posted >regarding installation of a valve from years ago. nonetheless, i >thought i'd bring this up again to see what opinion any of you might >have regarding this. This is how I handled the drain on my brew pot. I'm a 5 gallon batch brewer and use 3/8" copper tubing for my transfers. This works quite well for this size batch and would probably serve well for 10 gallons as well. Larger than that that would probably take too long the transfer the liquid to the fermenter My brew pot is a large (60 qt) aluminum stock pot, similar to a Volrath, just not that specific brand. It was a b-day gift from my XYL a couple of years back. I drilled and tapped a hole for 1/4"NPT in the pot about 1/2-1" up from the bottom. There is a modified brass ball valve on the outlet. To modify the valve to accept a 1/4"NPT I soldered a bushing into a copper T fitting. The bushing is flared and needs to be drilled with a 1/2" drill bit to remove the flared do not cut deeply enough into the bushing to provide a liquid tight seal. Screw a 1/4"NPT nipple into the bushing and solder it. This will provide a tight seal. Heat the T fitting to loosen the soldered and remove the bushing/nipple assembly (it was soldered into the T so that the T could be clamped in a vice while drilling/ tapping/soldering). Solder this assembly into the ball valve. Screw the modified ball valve into the hole in the brew pot. Make it good and tight, BUT be VERY CAREFUL not to over tighten it as is could strip (there are only about 2 thread cut in the pot). The end of the nipple will be protruding into the brew pot far enough so that a 1/4"NPT fitting can be securely fastened. On the inside of the pot I have a 1/4"NPT x 3/8" compressing fitting. I attach my pick-up to the compression fitting. The outlet of the ball valve can accept any of the many 1/2" sweat fittings, I've just never been able to locate a 1/4"NPT x 1/2" sweat. One fitting that is very handy is the 1/2" sweat x 3/8" compression. You might have to look for this at the larger stores (I found mine at Home Depot). I have modified 2 pots in this way (a total of 3 holes) and none have leaked, YMMV. If you are the anal retentive type, you might also consider adding an o-ring or some other sort of gasket material on the inside of the brew pot (over the nipple and between the pot and whatever fitting you place on the nipple). Good luck, John Schnupp, N3CNL Colchester, VT 95 XLH 1200 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 08:47:36 -0500 From: "Alan Meeker" <ameeker at welchlink.welch.jhu.edu> Subject: Carbs and barbs Steve Owens asks about fad diets... >Now since Atkins himself brings up the topic of ketosis and claims >that it's not a risk in this situation (basically, ketosis is a >usually symptom of Very Bad Things, but in this situation it's a >symptom of Good Things), the situation seems reduced to a series of >"Yes it is/No it's not" claims. It would be nice to see some >qualified medical person actually refute Atkins' claims instead of >waving their hands and dismissing it. Steve, this topic came up within the last year or so. I participated in some off-line discussions on this issue but some of it made it onto the HBD so try searching the archives. If what you find there doesn't help you out e-mail me and I'll cc you some of the discussions that I saved... ------------ Dave Burley takes me to task for questioning his credibility: >Alan, you don't have to believe me, >but I'd appreciate your keeping personal >opinions as to my credibility to a >non-public arena. I will agree to do so only if you agree to stop posting so many definitive statements on subjects you clearly don't have a handle on! >If I am wrong, I will >be more than happy to admit it if you >or others can provide the evidence. I've seen precious little evidence in your past behavior to indicate that this is true. -Alan Meeker Baltimore, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 08:51:34 EST From: "Gary Barbatelli" <garybarbatelli at hotmail.com> Subject: Re; Head Retention; Cask Breathers I've used both wheat malt and flaked barly, as well as flaked wheat, with good results. Flaked barley can tend to throw a chill haze. If that is an issue, then use it in darker beers.(Haze or no haze-all the same with me as long as the beer tastes good!) I don't know what the recommended amounts are. I guess that depends on the style your brewing. A good starting point is probably 5% of the grist There has been comments about CAMRA's stand on cask breathers in recent posts that I feel are inaccurate. For about the last 2 years or so CAMRA's official stand on cask breathers has sofened to the point that they condone its use on slow selling beers. Some of the individual branches still take a hard line but the official national policy has changed. Cheers, Gary Barbatelli ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 06:37:49 PST From: "Dic Gleason" <dicgleason at hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Lunacy This is from my brother at the the Southworth Planetarium, U of So. Maine What's the big deal? This next full moon will be the biggest and brightest full moon in living memory. It will occur on December 22, the date of the 1999 winter solstice. Why is it the biggest and brightest? We'll take this one in steps. The moon is full whenever it is on the opposite side of the Earth with respect to the sun. We therefore see the moon's entire illuminated half and it appears as a full circle in our sky. Despite popular opinion to the contrary, the moon is NOT generally closest to us when it's full. The moon is at its least distance from the Earth during one revolution when it is at its Perigee point. The period between successive perigees -called an anomalistic month- is approximately 27.5 days long. The period between succesive new moons-called a synodic month- is approximately 29.5 mean solar days. So, you can see that the moon is not usually at perigee when it is full. The time spans separating lunar phases and perigee points are not in sync. This doesn't mean, however, that the full moon can NEVER be at perigee. In fact, on the 22nd, the moon will be at opposition and perigee on the same day. Moreover, the perigee distance is not constant from one month to the next. It varies. It just so happens that the December perigee point will be closer than any other this year. So, to summarize: this full moon will be quite close to the Earth and will be, consequently, quite large. It will be 14% larger than when it is at apogee -its greatest distance. BUT, that's not all! The Earth and moon are approaching perihelion -the point in Earth's orbit which is closest to the sun. perihelion will occur on January 3rd. The sunlight striking the moon will be 7% stronger than now than it would be if we were at aphelion.So, we'll have a large moon subjected to strong sunlight. 1866 was the last time in which we've had the full moon at perigee on the winter solstice! Seems like a great reason to have some friends over and brew/enjoy beer. Dic Gleason So. Korea ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 10:10:05 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Re: Scaling Up - The Next Step? Steven, I'd say go for the all-grain thing. You can get an 8 gallon (33 quart) "ceramic on steel" pot for maybe $25 at a discount store. This will let you do full volume boils. A 5 or 10 gallon "Gott" (Rubbermaid, Igloo) cooler makes a fine mash tun. About $40 for the 10 gallon size, if you look. I made a "manifold" for mine out of copper tubing. It might have cost me $10 in parts, probably less. And then you need a chiller. Buy a 50 foot coil of 3/8 inch tubing, use some of it for the sparge manifold. and coil the rest into an immersion chiller. Add in some hoses, assorted fittings (so you can hook your chiller to the faucet) for maybe another $5? Your biggest expense may be a new burner, if your stove is just too wimpy to boil 6 gallons of wort. I use my gas stove with no problem. If you've got an electric stove, you may need to buy a burner ($60?) Add 'em up. Without the burner, you can get into all grain brewing for under $100. Depending on your ingredient cost, you'll probably save that much in 10 batches. Grain, if you don't buy it in little 1 or 5lb baggies at the brew store, is lots cheaper than malt extract. Quick comparison, ignoring shipping costs, assuming you can buy locally... St. Pats of Texas (www.stpats.com) sells 6lbs of (liquid) malt extract for $12-13. This is about enough to make a batch of pale ale. If you're buying cans now, you might be paying up to $20 for the extract for one batch of beer. (E.g., $12 for 4lbs of Coopers liquid malt extract plus $6 for 2 more lbs of dry malt extract.) They sell 10lb of Briess pale ale malt for about $8 (more or less, depending whether you want it crushed). This is also enough to make a batch of pale ale. So that's $4-10 per batch saved. However, if you buy a 50lb sack, it's only $33, or about $6/batch, for a savings of $6-12 per batch. Yes, you pay for it in your time, but that's the fun part. :-) Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 10:17:28 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Re: Calories/PID >>>>> "AJ" == AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com> writes: AJ> With all the discussion of calories in beer I thought you all AJ> might be interested in the way in which calories are AJ> calculated for beer. It's simply AJ> kcal/100grams beer = 6.9A + 4(B-C) AJ> where A is the % alcohol by weight (0.79ABV), B is the real AJ> extract (% by weight i.e. degrees P of the dealcoholized beer AJ> made back up to the same volume as the sample) and C is the AJ> ash expressed as a percent by weight (this is usually small AJ> enough that it can be ignored). I've seen this formula before, but today I was struck by the fact that the alcohol caloric density is higher than that of the carbos. So I'm thinking "how can this be?" After all, the yeast has extracted some energy from the original carbos. Then I recalled that 1/2 (roughly) of the mass of the original sugar has escaped as CO2. So 8 kcal of sugar turns into 6.9 kcal of alcohol, and the yeast "consume" 1.1kcal during fermentation. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 10:23:33 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu> Subject: Music to drink Pils by Brewers I just heard a delightful little three minute polka for piano, "Souvenir of Pilsen" (1844) by the 19th century Czech composer Bedrich Smetana. [Ivan Moravec, piano (House of Artists, Prague, 12/18/84) (Nonesuch 791462)]. Composed just about the same time as modern Pilsener was being invented. Just thought other music loving brewers might like to know. BTW, I heard it on WKAR-FM in Lansing, which streams audio at http://www.wkar.org. With fewer and fewer public radio stations broadcasting classical music, they are getting listeners from all over the globe. If your station has gone to all talk, check it out. Now back to your regularly scheduled discussion about upsidedown reverse PID RIMS. Jeff -=-=-=-=- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 09:23:10 -0600 From: MVachow at newman.k12.la.us Subject: scaling up/homebrew shop Steve inquires about an economical way of scaling up his brew gear. If you're convinced that homebrewing is something you'll continue to do, then I recommend the following. First, a 100K+ BTU burner. Your local Home Depot or Lowe's will sell you one for $40. These things are nothing special. Every third family in New Orleans has one to boil crawfish. They use them in North Georgia to boil peanuts, in Texas to make chili, in Maine to boil lobsters, in Michigan for the whitefish fry. Second a 15-20 gallon pot. You can pick up a 20 aluminum pot at the Home Depot while you're getting the burner for at $120. A stainless steel pot of the same size will run you more along the lines of $250. Another option is to convert a 15 gallon sanke keg. If you don't mind scrounging a bit, you can often turn these things up at salvage yards where they'll let them go for 10 or 20 bucks. You could make an immersion chiller as per the kinds of instructions you mention finding on the web, or buy one. Get a big one. At this point, having blown at $200 (assuming the aluminum pot here), you'd be ready to brew 10-15 gallon batches of extract beer. If you want to brew all-grain beers, you'll need a little extra gear. The cheapest way to go is to use picnic coolers, either the cylindrical kind or the rectangular kind. Pick up two at the KMart--run you $50 total. Go back to the Home Depot and get about 4 feet of 1/2" CPVC pipe and some Ts and elbows to build a manifold for the bottom of the mash unit: at $8. The project requires a hacksaw and about 30 minutes. There are easy instructions in the Lutzen and Stevens book Brew Ware. Use the other picnic cooler as your sparge water tank. At this point, you've got a perfectly functional all-grain system (major shortcoming: a bit of hoisting of hot liquids), and you've spent about $260. Best of all, you're brewing outdoors instead of gumming up your brand new kitchen. There is also a bit of perverse pleasure to be found in befuddling Mr. Jones next door who has to wonder if the new neighbors are setting up a meth lab, and conversely there is the unadulterated pleasure of dispelling those frightful thoughts when you hand Mr. Jones a pint of your homebrewed stout. - ----------------------------------------------------------- Jared inquires about the viability of brew supply shop start-up. I don't own a store, just a crank who tries to stay abreast of beer and brewing industry news. As you've probably heard, there's lots of noise in the homebrewing community about community supply shops going out of business and market power drifting toward big Etail operations. I think, it's just the expected shakeout. The hobby is in decline, but I think the decline is mainly the leveling off of a fad. There are plenty of serious homebrewers left and still plenty of prospective new brewers out there. I think opening a supply shop now would follow all the rules of any other small business. If you did a careful market study, found a good spot, had enough capital to stock the place well, offer competitive prices and advertise yourself, did the vast bulk of the labor yourself and put in the time outside business hours to make connections with clubs, the local craft brewers, etc. If you did all of that and were willing to live frugally or had a second income of some sort, you'd probably have as good a shot as any other small business. Mike Return to table of contents
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