HOMEBREW Digest #3998 Thu 25 July 2002

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  Beer storage, fermenter material (Randy Barnes)
  re: dry ice (JohanNico)" <JohanNico.Aikema at akzonobel.com>
  priming sugar (Saison) (leavitdg)
  re: propane ("Brian Morgan")
  Re: Glass vs. Plastic (again) ("Chad Gould")
  RE: Propane ("Steven Parfitt")
  Beer Road Trip ("Bates, Floyd SEPCO")
  Re: plastic primarys, septic tank, propane ("Larry Bristol")
  Homebrewing chemicals, septic tanks and the environment (John Scime)
  re: beer names (Paul Kensler)
  Re: toasting malt (Rob Dewhirst)
  Re: septic tanks and brewing (Rob Dewhirst)
  RE: fermenting in an engine block ("Drew Avis")
  RE:  ball lock kegs, stupid brewer tricks (Mark Alfaro)
  Re: Beer preservation with yeast? (Kevin Crouch)
  Traquair House, etc. (Scott Perfect)
  Pike's "Naughty Nellie" (eevans)
  Fw: Stockmarket Advice, virutally speechless, Northwest Trip ("Dave Burley")
  Hops and head (gremake)
  Re: Brewing without lifting ("Larry Bristol")
  ball lock kegs, plastic vs glass debate ("dave holt")
  Champagne yeast taste effects? ("Doug Moyer")
  Ball lock kegs (Kent Fletcher)
  Re: Acetobacter - Thanks for the help - one more question (Kent Fletcher)
  Re: HERMS / pump - Immersion chiller as HERMS coil (Kent Fletcher)
  Propane - Todd and Paul's questions (Kent Fletcher)
  Re: What's in your fridge (beer snacks) ("Kevin Morgan")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 00:18:43 -0700 From: Randy Barnes <rbarnes at sdccd.cc.ca.us> Subject: Beer storage, fermenter material Ed Jones asked about preservation of beer on yeast. I've had great success with leaving a minimal amount of yeast in kegs, not intentionally, just the normal amount left behind after racking. Storage at low temperatures (my fridge is at about 38 deg. F) may be the key. I brought a 1 1/2 yr. old Rauchbier to a meeting tonight, and a BJCP Master judge highly complimented it on its quality. Regarding fermenters, I've switched from plastic to stainless pots. The tall, narrow turkey-fryer style. No airlock, set the lid on and put a plastic trash bag over the top to keep any nasties from "seeping" around the not-airtight seal. They're unbreakable, easy to sanitize by cleaning then boiling a couple of inches of water in them (with the lid on). I didn't have any problems with plastic, however, except I like the idea of heat sanitizing. I use glass for long-term storage of meads. Randy in San Diego Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:14:55 +0200 From: "Aikema, J.N. (JohanNico)" <JohanNico.Aikema at akzonobel.com> Subject: re: dry ice Hi, I'm a little bit slow with HBDigest (holiday in Germany). "Kevin Boyer" <kboyer at houston.rr.com asked about using dry ice to cool the wort. Dry ice (solid carbondioxyde ) has a temperature of approx. -80 C (-176 F). In (hot) water it immediately starts to boil. So you will get a lot of foam, but no fast drop in temperature. I don't know anything about the potential infection danger, I think it depends on the source of the CO2. When you airate your wort, most of the CO2 will be blown off. Greetings from Holland (Europe), Hans Aikema http://www.hopbier.myweb.nl Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 06:06:37 -0400 (EDT) From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu Subject: priming sugar (Saison) I am not sure...but have used this yeast many times...and find that it, like some wine and other belgian styles keep working in the bottle.. I think that the next time I use it I will be closer to 1/2 cup corn sugar for a 5-5.5 gallon batch..the first few that you have may be a little under carbonated...but over time they will gain...I think. It is not uncommon (for me) to leave some of these in the fridge for several months and find that they are way over carbonated... Happy Brewing! .Darrell Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:05:06 -0400 From: "Brian Morgan" <brian-morgan at cinci.rr.com> Subject: re: propane Paul and Tod wrote: >>Would it be feasible to connect my outdoor burners >>to the big propane tank, and if so, how? >Tod, >Now, "how" is a different matter. My large propane >tank is pretty near my brew-deck, so I had hoped to >find a pre-made solution for connecting it to my >burners. I checked online, I checked local hardware >and BBQ stores, I checked with local propane and >propane accessory companies, and all I got was blank >stares. I suppose that somebody with the proper >experience could permanently plumb the line and >fittings using copper and brass, but I really wanted >something flexible that could be coiled up and put >away after use - basically, something exactly like the >hose that connects my little tank to my gas grill, >just longer (maybe 10 - 12'). Either a replacement >hose with regulator, or an extension hose. So far, >I've come up empty. Did you try RV supply shops? RV's and campers use propane as well, and I would think there would be some long hose runs in some of those vehicles. They might be able to make or order one. Brian Cincinnati Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:34:02 -0400 From: "Chad Gould" <cgould11 at tampabay.rr.com> Subject: Re: Glass vs. Plastic (again) > "Chad Gould" <cgould11 at tampabay.rr.com> wrote: > >You can ferment in plastic if you want. However, as you said, you > >will probably have to replace a plastic vessel every year or so. Glass > >lasts much longer. > Do you have statistics for those statements? The reason I ask is > that IME carboys tend to break well before plastic fermenters, and > I use plastic primaries almost exclusively with no infection problems-- > the only infection I've had in the past several years involved brewing > outdoors and various small flying insects (it wasn't pretty). I replace > the plastic fermenters roughly every 5-7 years strictly out of superstition. > My beers taste pretty good and do well in competition when I bother to > enter them. Hmm... To me, the factor in replacement regardless of cleaning techniques would have to involve how long you can hold a liquid in plastic before the plastic starts taking on characteristics of the liquid itself. Perhaps even then you could probably still brew decent beer, but my personal superstition would wonder about whether any of the old beer flavor would leak over, and whether a beer-smelling plastic bucket on its own could be totally clean, regardless of cleaning technique. But I know of no studies that explore this, and even then I would say that its possible different plastic buckets have a different absorbtion rate. >From my perspective, glass will last as long as you are careful with it. I suppose plastic will last as long too. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:48:52 -0400 From: "Steven Parfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: Propane If you wanna brew out you've got to light her up; propane. If you wanna get down, brew on the ground; propane. She don't light, she don't light, she don't light; propane. If you got bad news, you wanna kick them blues; propane. When your out of gas, and you got no stash of; propane. She don't light, she don't light, she don't light; propane. If your gas is gone and you wanna brew on; propane. Don't forget this fact, you can't sparage and knock out; Without propane. She don't light, she don't light, she don't light; propane. She don't light, she don't light, she don't light; NO! propane. With all due respect to E.C. Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery http://thegimp.8k.com Johnson City, TN [422.7, 169.2] Rennerian "Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von Bismarck Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 07:49:19 -0500 From: "Bates, Floyd SEPCO" <floyd.bates at shell.com> Subject: Beer Road Trip All: I am planning a 7-10 day trip to test my body's limitations at alcohol excretion. I will be flying to Seattle and ultimately ending up in Portland. Can you help me plan my trip by providing me with a list of breweries/brewpubs that I should visit as I head south? I can do my own homework if you can provide a brewery name and town. Thanks in advance. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 07:53:48 -0500 From: "Larry Bristol" <Larry at DoubleLuck.com> Subject: Re: plastic primarys, septic tank, propane On Mon, 22 Jul 2002 12:08:46 -0400, Tod H Lewark <mrgoodbeer at juno.com> wrote: > I'm moving to a country house with a septic tank and propane heat. >Regarding the septic tank, are there any sanitizers or other chemicals I >should or should not use in brewing, winemaking, or housekeeping? Just remember that a septic system only works if it is alive, so you do not want to pour so many chemicals down the drain that you kill the microorganisms doing the work. But don't get panicky! Think about how much iodophor (for example) you would need to pour into the relatively HUGE volume of the septic tank to get the same concentration you use to sanitize a 5 gallon fermenter. The brewing chemicals going into your septic system will become so diluted that the system is relatively safe (unless you are brewing something like 50 b. every day). On the positive side, be sure to dump any trub and any other unwanted yeasties down the drain! Your septic system will love you for this. > Would it be feasible to connect my outdoor burners to the big >propane tank, and if so, how? Just like the little propane tanks, there is a regulator that controls the pressure of the propane coming out of the tank going into your house. Your new connection must be downstream from that regulator. The regulator itself is probably not physically on (or even near) the big tank. It is more likely to be found somewhere near the house where the gas service enters the structure, and probably looks somewhat like a gas meter. I would suggest that adding your own gas connections is NOT a do-it-yourself type of project, but your propane supply company probably has service people who could do the job. The most expensive part of it would probably be running the new gas line (since I assume you would want it to be underground). > I have a nice antique gas stove I've brewed on for about 15 years >also. Can I convert it to propane, and if so, how? There are kits available for converting stoves from methane to propane. You should be able to find them at just about any good hardware or home store. One of the main factors for the conversion is to replace the actual burners, because propane burns at a higher temperature than does methane. I do not know what the rest of the conversion might involve. OTOH, if your stove is a high value collectible antique, you might want to consider the impact conversion might have on its value. At the least, you would certainly want to keep the original parts so that it could be "restored" someday. > There is a slow spring (like a faucet on medium opening) I will >have tested, downhill. Any suggestions on a low-flow pump? I also have >city water. I have no advice in this regard. Sorry. Regards, Larry Bristol Bellville, TX AR=[1093.6,223.2] http://www.doubleluck.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 06:12:46 -0700 (PDT) From: John Scime <jascime at yahoo.com> Subject: Homebrewing chemicals, septic tanks and the environment Tod H Lewark asks about his septic system and the affect of chemical sanitizers. As it happens, Drew Avis and I (both mebers of HOZERS - the 'Hull/Ottawa Zymurgic Enterprises and Research Society' - a name derived from the seminal Canadian cult film "Strange Brew") have been researching this very issue. We don't have any solid answers yet, but here are some suggestions that might be of use. Generally speaking, if you're on a septic system chances are you're also drawing water from a well, which means you should be aware that chemicals can leach into the water table, and from there into your drinking supply and that of your neighbours. When in doubt about the disposal of a chemical substance save it in old jars/bottles/buckets and take it to your municipal hazardous waste disposal site (held twice yearly in my municipality). Some towns/cities have permanent facilities where you can dispose of anything from used oil, paint thinner and paint, to gasoline, etc. They will certainly take your used sanitizer. Of course, this is also a good practice for city-brewers, since whatever you flush is eventually "recycled" through municipal water purification plants, and consumed again. Regarding "safer" santizer, in past e-mail correspondence with a brewert British Columbia, Canada, (an organic operation) we were told that they used a product called Oxonia, made by Ecolab. It is peroxyacetic acid - a mix of hydrogen peroxide and acetic acid. Apparently it breaks down into water and acetic acid, which can be neutralized by the addition of baking soda - a simple pH strip test will tell you when it has become pH neutral and safe to flush. Lastly, it is important to follow the "three Rs": 1. Reduce - make only as much santizer/cleanser as you require (this will also save $$); 2. Reuse - when stored in a sealed bucket, you can reuse what you make. You can monitor the effectiveness of some sanitizers with a simple ph test (I think the papers are in a lower range than those used for mashing) - this will enable you to use the mixture until the ph drops out of effective range. 3. Recycle - dispose of spent product responsibly (as per the above suggestions). Hope this helps. John Scime and Drew Avis HOZERS BTW - one of the best ways to protect your septic system is to use a laundry soap that does not contain filler material, which can and will eventually plug drain pipes and weaping beds - my wife and I use a liquid soap for this reason. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 06:13:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Paul Kensler <paul_kensler at yahoo.com> Subject: re: beer names Dave Holt said: "Part of the joy of brewing is sharing and thinking up the name of the brew." That reminds me of the batch of "Armpit Amber" that I brewed with my friend Rob Hanson... Perhaps I should keep that story to myself, at least while there is still beer in the keg I'm trying to get rid of - er, wanting to share. Paul Kensler Gaithersburg, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:46:47 -0500 From: Rob Dewhirst <rob at hairydogbrewery.com> Subject: Re: toasting malt At 01:11 AM 7/23/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Subject: RE: Toast My malt On thing to be mindful of is the smell. I heavily toasted some unmalted barley a few months back and the whole house reeked of burnt popcorn for days. No smoke either, and I was doing this at the recommended 300-350F. 30 mins probably won't create much of a problem, but just thought I would warn you. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:02:05 -0500 From: Rob Dewhirst <rob at hairydogbrewery.com> Subject: Re: septic tanks and brewing At 01:11 AM 7/23/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Regarding the septic tank, are there any sanitizers or other chemicals I >should or should not use in brewing, winemaking, or housekeeping? So long as you are pouring diluted versions of sanitizing solutions into the septic system and using common sense, most brewing chemicals should not be a problem. Once your dilute solutions go down the drain and dilute again in several hundred gallons of water, they won't be a hazard to the beneficial organisms in your tank. Even if you manage to kill off a lot of microbes in your tank, healthy tanks rebound quickly. There are a few things I won't run into my septic system, but they aren't chemicals. I don't put large amounts of spent grain or hop leaves down the drain, and I don't run the exhaust port from my chiller water into the septic because of the volume of water (and I reuse that water in the garden). I am far more worried about clogging the lateral field than chemically contaminating the tank. Your best bet is to contact your local extension office (or an extension office in a neighboring rural county if your county is mostly urban) and ask if they have pamphlets or web pages on septic maintenance. There are many good net sites on this subject, but regional variations in soil and health regulations can vary, so a local source is better. Most of the generic instruction booklets that talk about care and feeding of a septic system are easily related to brewing instead of cooking in the kitchen. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:25:06 -0400 From: "Drew Avis" <andrew_avis at hotmail.com> Subject: RE: fermenting in an engine block Winterpeg Brew Bomber and virtual Hozer Brian Lundeen reveals the secret to his high-torque fermentations when he writes "I ferment my beer in an old Chevy engine block." Luxury! I can only dream of fermenting in plastic, glass, stainless, or an old Chevy engine block! I have to ferment in an old cardboard box I found out at the dump, although I managed to clean out most of the mould and rat droppings. Drew Avis ~ http://www.strangebrew.ca If you ever drop your keys into a river of molten lava, let'em go, because, man, they're gone. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 07:56:03 -0700 From: Mark Alfaro <malfaro at qcpi.com> Subject: RE: ball lock kegs, stupid brewer tricks Hi Dave, I have purchased ball lock kegs from RCB Fermentation Equipment a few times. The kegs I received were in good condition. Since these are used kegs, you should replace all the seals. You can purchase the replacement seals from RCB, or from your local homebrew shop for a couple bucks. On my last order with them, I bought seven keg lids to replace ones I had with no pressure relief. They threw in new O rings for the lids, plus an extra screw in relief valve for free. I would recommend them. No affiliation, just a satisfied customer. Mark Alfaro Chula Vista, CA 1950, 262.1 Rennerian Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 17:06:41 -0700 From: "dave holt" <brewdave at hotmail.com> Subject: ball lock kegs, stupid brewer tricks Has anyone bought ball lock kegs from RCB Fermentation Equipment? Were you happy with the kegs? Did the o-rings need replacing? Etc. I need a source for reasonably priced kegs and am open for suggestions. TIA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:27:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Kevin Crouch <kcrouching at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Beer preservation with yeast? Ed, in response to your questions about "preserving" your beer with yeast, you can find and incredible amount of experience, prose, and solutions in the archives here. In short, yeast can have wonderful benefits in keeping a beer tasting fresh, but there are many ways in which yeast can ruin your beer if not treated properly. As far as lagering goes, I've found that a fully attenuated lager and one without a lot of residual dextrins, will withstand the trials of time better than one that is not. This has become a point of increasing interest to me in my lagering trials. I once had a big lager that didn't get down below 1.020 lagering for over 2 months. Just as I was about to give it a clean bill of health, tap it up and enjoy its malty wonders, a thermostat mixup left my lagering freezer **off** for 5 days in 70 degree weather while I was out of town. Not thinking too much of it, I tapped into a foamy, rough Belgian Lager, with ugly esters and phenols. After a fit of rage and denial, with over a pint of 7% bock in me, I said "Bock, you are dead to me". But I let it rest, and it eventually came back into shape over a few more weeks, but things would never be the same between us. Another beer, a golden Maibock that did ferment out nicely to 1012 or so, kept very well in its bottle-conditioned womb for 8 months, though, it did benefit nicely from a week at fridge temps before serving. You state that you are not going to bottle condition, but will leave live yeast in the bottle. It is highly likely that, depending on how you fill it, the flavor will diminish some due to the fact that the yeast is not metabolically active, but it should, however survive the trauma much better than one that is filtered. If youv've been gentle and thorough with it at all prior stages, you shouldn't have a problem. Kevin Crouch Vancouver, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 10:07:52 -0700 From: Scott Perfect <perfect at marzen.llnl.gov> Subject: Traquair House, etc. Julio, in 3993, asked: >Among the highlights of our trip was a visit to Traquair House and its >brewery. Now my quest is to try and emulate their House Ale. >I have saved bits of past postings regarding this Ale. As far as I know, I>t is a Scotch Ale, 7.2% abv (strong ale?), EKG hops, H. Baird malt and >black malt. Also caramelization is obtained by boiling the first gallon >of a five gal batch, down to a quart and adding this caramelized wort >back at the end of the regular boil. Will probably use Wyeast Scottish >Ale. Ray Daniels also talks about Traquair House Ale in his book: >Designing Great Beers, Chapter on Scotish Ales. >Any guidance, help, notes, recipes will be greately appreciated. Noonan's book "Scotch Ale" indicates 1% Roasted Barley. Please don't use black malt... Hops additions at beginning of boil and 15 minutes before - ------------------ Gentlemen, what would your dynamics instructors say? You are all aware that you are speaking of Coriolis ACCELERATION. - ------------------ Marc - Be glad you weren't caught with blunt-nosed child's scissors in your purse as my wife was last month... (I'll spare you the unfunny aspects of this and keep it light.) - ------------------ Scott A. Perfect San Ramon, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:17:18 GMT From: eevans at moscow.com Subject: Pike's "Naughty Nellie" Uh, long time listener, first time poster. Last time I was in Seattle I snagged a bottle of Pike's Naughty Nellie, and I really liked it - very well balanced. I'd like to brew a similar thing up before I dive into the winter beers. The official description is "...a mildy hopped beer with a complex malt character and a soft creamy head. Naughty Nellie's possesses a soft fruitiness with light yeast esters of apricot and orange."[1] I'm pretty much in the dark figuring out a recipe. Given the recent post about vienna malts modest character, I think it's good candidate. Any tips on yeast would also be appreciated. Wyeasts 1318 (London Ale III) "fruity, very light, soft balanced palate, finishes slightly sweet"[2] sounds promising. 1332 (Northwest Ale) is probably better given it's "One of the classic ale strains from the Northwest U.S. Breweries. Produces a malty and mildly fruity ale with good depth and complexity."[2] I've never used either of these, though. Cheers, -Ed Evans [1] http://www.merchantduvin.com/pages/3_pike_brewing/nellies.html [2] http://www.wyeastlab.com/beprlist.htm - --------------------------------------------- This message was sent by First Step Internet. http://www.fsr.net/ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 17:54:16 -0400 From: "Dave Burley" <Dave_BURLEY at CHARTER.NET> Subject: Fw: Stockmarket Advice, virutally speechless, Northwest Trip Brewsters: Here's a new perspective: If you bought $1000.00 worth of Nortel stock one year ago, it would now be worth $49.00. If you bought $1000.00 worth of Budweiser (the beer, not the stock) one year ago, drank all the beer then traded in the cans at a redemption center for the nickel deposit, you would have $107.00. Given the current conditions of the stock market, my advice, based on this example, is to buy beer (but not Budweiser) drink heavily and recycle. - ----------------- I guess I was in too big of a hurry to fire up my new box of computer toys when I got back from the NW. I have been virtually speechless since I did a really stoopid thing on the advice of a computer professional while preparing to transfer data to my new computer ( I'm using it now) from my old one. But it is still my fault since I felt uncomfortable doing it and should have listened to that still small voice in the back of my skull. Now I need some help from you computer adepts out there. I formatted the virtual E drive on my partitioned HD. I lost C drive with all my stuff and Win95 OS on it. Tape backup was not up to date. D has a full copy of the C drive but out of date. D,E and F still appear to be intact. I know, I know! Trying to boot Win95 from D got me a "Himem.sys missing" error. Anyone have any suggestions for some good recovery software or other suggestions please e-mail privately. - ---------------------------------- On the positive side, I got back from a visit to Victoria, BC and Seattle, WA and I can definitely say that the myth of the cold and rainy NW US is pure BS, unless I used up their annual quota of nice weather while I was there. I mean 7 days and nothing but warm and beautiful weather - can you believe it? Both Victoria and Seattle were beautiful SWMBO and I had a great time ( she threatened to stay shopping in Victoria and send me off to Seattle) . Best of all I can confirm that homebrewers are the best and friendliest people in the world. I met and had dinner and brews with Bill Riel, his SWMBO and friends in Victoria,BC and Charles Rich in Seattle where we had a hoppy ESB that would fool a Brit, along with a few other good pints.. What a wonderful time in both places. Nice people! Thanks to both for your excellent hospitality. I will give my comments on the various beers I drank and micros I toured at a later date. I'm busy trying to recover my data and comments I put together. Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:57:11 -0500 From: gremake at gsb.uchicago.edu Subject: Hops and head Hello all, A while back, Jeff Renner commented on the improved foam stand he got after adding some hops extract to one of his brews. This was the first I've heard about this effect, but when I reviewed my own recipe notes, there was a definite correlation between late hop additions and foam stand. In fact, those recipes where I noted exceptional head retention were also those with the largest late additions. Notably, the alts where I made only single bittering additions had weak head retention (although I guessed that was due to protein rests). Have I just missed out on some common brewing knowledge? Should hops really have that big an impact on head? Does the hop variety matter, or the alpha acid rating? I've always thought that the grist and mashing schedule dictated foam stand, but if the style can handle it, I'm ready to bump up late additions substantially if it gets me that elusive rocky head. Cheers, Greg Chicago, IL Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 17:12:08 -0500 From: "Larry Bristol" <Larry at DoubleLuck.com> Subject: Re: Brewing without lifting On Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:37:20 -0400, walcin1 at comcast.net wrote: > I am in need of some advice on how to limit the lifting needed in >brewing. I have been diagnosed with a degenerative disk problem in my neck >which will be fixed soon through surgery. My wife (SWMBO) insists that I >need to find a way to brew that won't require the lifting of 5 - 7 gallons >any longer. I have been given the green light on getting a brewing system. >But I guess that my most important consideration is the lifting. Can this >this be accomplished? I am an all grain brewer and really love brewing and >am supported in this hobby (??) by my wife. Private or public responses are >welcome and encouraged. Who else could I turn to in a time of need but you? When I have a particularly daunting problem at work, the answer often comes to me in my sleep. This happens so often, in fact, that it no longer surprises me. Well, since turnabout is fair play, it pleases me to note that an answer to Mark's question came to me while I was wide awake, fighting a particularly daunting problem at work! I certainly agree with the prior comments on this question. Lifting liquid is one of the major problems to overcome, and it would seem that the best way to do this is to use a pump. But there are other heavy items that must be lifted and/or moved during a brewing cycle that cannot be handled this way, such as equipment, grains (especially spent), kegs of beer, and so on. A three tier brewing system is certainly a step in the right direction, but only if a pump is included. In an all-gravity system, you generally have (from top to bottom) the liquor tank, mash/lauter tun, and brew kettle. This overall height required for such a system may make it difficult to use if you are lift challenged. In a system that uses a pump, however, it is better to have (again from top to bottom) the mash/lauter tun, boil kettle, and liquor tank. This enables you to introduce cold water into the system at the lowest level (no lift), heat it, and then pump it up to the mash/lauter tun for both the dough-in and the sparge. Gravity moves the runnings into the boil kettle. And since the kettle is not on the bottom tier, there is plenty of height left to drain the wort into the fermenter, although you can also pump it from the kettle, eliminating the need to lift the fermenter after it is filled. There is a nifty option on a brewing system from Beer, Beer, and More Beer (http://www.morebeer.com) [Yabbadabbadoo] where the mash/lauter tun is mounted on hinges, allowing you to tilt it over and dump the spent grains onto a chute that feeds into your garbage can (or whatever means you have for their disposal). This surely seems to me to be handy to avoid lifting the spent grains, although it does not address the problem of lifting them into the mash tun in the first place. Perhaps there are other interesting goodies available. But no matter how many gadgets you find, there are still going to be items that just have to be lifted or moved in some way. It seems, perhaps, that no perfect solution is available. This is where serendipity steps in. Recently, I met some fairly inexperienced, but very enthusiastic homebrewers. We have gotten together to brew on three different occasions. The experience (to me, at least) has been very satisfying in many ways. But the point is, perhaps because they have taken pity on the old man, but I have noted that I have not done nearly so much heavy lifting recently. Eureka! Here is the perfect solution to the problem! Locate some younger, less experienced, but enthusiastic brewers in your area. [Read: strong backs, weak minds. Gosh, I hope my guys are not reading this!] Offer to share your brewing knowledge and experience with them. You gain, because they get to do all the lifting. They gain because they learn all those brewing secrets you have acquired. We all gain because the homebrewing community becomes closer together. QED Regards, Larry Bristol Bellville, TX AR=[1093.6,223.2] http://www.doubleluck.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:37:17 -0700 From: "dave holt" <brewdave at hotmail.com> Subject: ball lock kegs, plastic vs glass debate I received one favorable response regarding RCB Fermentation Equipment for a keg source. As expected, it was recommended to buy the o-ring kit too. Thanks. I would like to support my local HB shops on this item but they have become ridiculously expensive in the Phoenix area. While on ball locks, all that I own leak on the CO2 side with the tank attached. I use quick disconnects. I have tried replacing the outer o-rings, thicker ones, keg lube, none of these have worked. The only thing left is replacing the poppets or go to a different type of connection. Anyone else had this problem and have suggestions? Generally, I just gassed up with 15 psi, use 5 ft of 3/16" hose and draw down until it needs charged again. A pain to keep up on during a party. Got to join the fermenter debate. In the early years of brewing, I used plastic fermenters and bleach as a sanitizer. Why, because that was how I was taught. In competitions, every judge commented that my beer had bleach residue in the flavor profile. I believe it was described as chlorophenol. Rinsing with scalding water did not help and defeated the purpose of sanitizing. Add infection was enough for me to switch to glass and iodophor. Pouring out beer is a horrible thing. For me, the switch made a notable difference. I'm sure great beer can be made in plastic, it just didn't work for me. There are as many ways to brew as there are brewers. Part of the fun. Dave Holt Forest Lakes, AZ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 20:43:09 -0400 From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com> Subject: Champagne yeast taste effects? Brewers, My BigBrew '02 old ale is still at 1.054 (started at 1.128). Accordingly, I took a vial of champagne yeast that has been sitting in my fridge for over two years and made a starter. Tonight, I decanted the chilled supernatant off of the yeast. The starter wort was made from pale DME and pressure canned. (No hops.) So, I tasted the "beer" from the starter. Obviously not hoppy... It had a taste similar to a Belgian dubbel. Almost a bit sour. What taste effects can I expect from champagne yeast? I will put some more starter wort on the cake to build it up and await answers... IMSR? Brew on! Doug Moyer Salem, VA Star City Brewers Guild: http://hbd.org/starcity "There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness.'" ~ Dave Barry Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 17:57:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Kent Fletcher <fletcherhomebrew at yahoo.com> Subject: Ball lock kegs Dave Holt asked: >Has anyone bought ball lock kegs from RCB >Fermentation Equipment? Were you happy with the >kegs? Did the o-rings need replacing? Dave, I have purchased 7 ball lock cornies from RCB over the last year or so. They have all held pressure and not been really beat up looking, though you will have to remove those pesky, sticky, "Propery of Pepsi" type labels. RCB occasionally has other great deals, as well. Kent Fletcher brewing in So Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:12:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Kent Fletcher <fletcherhomebrew at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Acetobacter - Thanks for the help - one more question In Digest #3996 Marc Hache asked: >Kent Fletcher mentioned test strips for the iodophor >solution, Kent can I get more detail ? I checked with >my LHBS and they have never heard of them, do you >?>have a brand or manufacturer name ? Marc, I should have mentioned that at the time. Check out All QA Products at http://www.allqa.com/aqa1227-8.htm I have personally switched to StarSan, as it doesn't stain tubing. But Iodophor is still a valuable product, and with the test kit you can keep a standing bucket of solution, just top it up to strength as needed. And with those plastic fermenters, I really do think you need to fill them and let them sit to be sure of your sanitation, "swishing" is just not as effective. Hope that helps. Kent Fletcher brewing in So Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:49:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Kent Fletcher <fletcherhomebrew at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: HERMS / pump - Immersion chiller as HERMS coil In Digest #3966, Road Frog (any relation to the Bud Mascots?) asked: >Is anybody using their immersion chiller as their >HERMS coil? We (a few Maltose Falcons) recently did a club/demo brew doing just that at out host LHBS. 50 foot 3/8" OD immersion chiller. Worked very nicely, making aoubt 1 degree F/minute rise. >Is a 1/15 hp pump to much? I have a variable >transformer to back it down a bit. I brought my home HERMS pump in for this brew. This little pump is only 1/50th hp, but can still move 6 gpm at 5 foot of head. To answer your question, while 1/15 hp is certainly more than you need (assuming you're HLT isn't on the roof), it is also not too much pump. But do yourself a favor: use a valve on the output side of the pump instead of a variac. Lowering supply votage to any A.C. motor is not a good practice. Some brewers use solid state speed controls (which actually pulse the full voltage on and off at varying rates to adjust motor speed). The prefered method of controling throughput of centrifugal pumps, ESPECIALLY fractional hp units, is to throttle the output. This keeps the motor turning at full speed, which is necessary to avoid overheating the motor windings. Using a variac will work, but with horrible efficiency and shortened equipment life. Hope that helps. Kent Fletcher brewing in So Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 19:27:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Kent Fletcher <fletcherhomebrew at yahoo.com> Subject: Propane - Todd and Paul's questions While it is always best to use hard pipe as much as possible, the Uniform Plumbing Code allows a flexible gas connector of up to 15 feet in length for outdoor portable appliances only [UPC 1212ex.7] [2607.6]. Note that some state and local jurisdicitons have shorter maximum lengths for some types of connectors. Generally, a shut-off valve is required at the appliance, and the flexible connector cannot pass through any building or appliance walls. Some jurisdictions allow copper piping for gas, which is very easy for a reasonably "handy" brewer to install. If copper isn't legal in your area, use threaded black iron pipe with proper sealant, and with all materials perform bubble tests at all joints. While the SOV is required at the appliance, it's also a good idea to have one at the supply end of the flex line for additional safety. Hope that helps. Kent Fletcher brewing in So Cal Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 22:56:55 -0400 From: "Kevin Morgan" <vze29s6t at verizon.net> Subject: Re: What's in your fridge (beer snacks) Jim asks cut> What is your favorite beer snack and what is the most unusual "snack" you have seen served at a bar? cut> In Thailand you can usually find fried grasshoppers in a bowl on the bar. They aren't half bad as long as you don't eat the heads. Kevin.....Brewing in South Jersey Return to table of contents
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