HOMEBREW Digest #4515 Wed 07 April 2004

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  Philly Homebrew Competition reminder ("Joe Uknalis")
  San Antonio Visit (Rob Zamites)
  Re: 5 layered Black and Tan (ODB OAK BARREL STOUT) ("Ken Taborek")
  Visit to Munich (Thomas Rohner)
  Curious Yeast Behaviour ("William Erskine")
  adding H20 to the kettle (darrell.leavitt)
  Quick Beers (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Where am I? ("River Bound Brewing")
  Re: Water salts: kettle vs. mashtun (Jeff Renner)
  Re: Re: session beer recipe (Jeff Renner)
  Re: head retention (Jeff Renner)
  HELP!! (Himsbrew)
  Where I am at! (Lee Ellman)
  Cheap Refrigerator Temperature Controller ("Spencer Graham")
  Call for Judges - AHA Southern Regional (Bev Blackwood II)
  dry yeast (Mark Beck)
  Where in the world? (Bev Blackwood II)
  Dry hopping problem ("Dan Hansen")
  re: session beer recipe ("Tom M")
  pumps ("Greg Hunter")
  beer & health (again) ("-S")
  Barrel Aged (David Perez)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 21:00:36 -0400 From: "Joe Uknalis" <birman at netaxs.com> Subject: Philly Homebrew Competition reminder Dear Beer folks- Just a reminder that Homebrewers of Philly & Suburbs is having thier 21st annual competition on 4/24/04. BJCP sanctioned. Entries are $6 each and due by 4/17. Prospective judges & stewards are encouraged to contact Joe at birman at netaxs.com full details at: http://www.hopsclub.org/ thanks Joe Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 23:16:00 -0500 From: Rob Zamites <popeye at zamites.net> Subject: San Antonio Visit Hello all! Been years since I've posted, and it's nice to be back.... Spencer Thomas told us: > The usual: I'll be in San Antonio for a conference, and would like to > meet other homebrewers. Evenings of April 19-23 are more-or-less > open. (23rd my boss might be there, 21st & 22nd look to have evening > conference activities.) Recommendations on brewpubs are also solicited. Well, I'm a homebrewer, and odds are I will be in town on the dates you stated, unless something drastic (like sudden employment) happens. A cool place to meet homebrewers and drink a few good beers is at San Antonio Homebrew Supply. The proprietor, Todd Huntress, is a knowledgeable fellow, and generally has 4-6 very good guest beers on tap. Poor San Antonio, though, has only one brewpub, Blue Star Brewing. The beers are pretty good, not the best I've had, but not insipid and lackluster as some other pubs I've visited. You can find them online at http://www.bluestarbrewing.com ... The former Laboratory Brewing Company is re-opened now under the name "Cementville", with master brewer Paul Farnsworth heading up the brewery operations. However, they haven't even gotten a start on the construction phase of the brewhouse (but the equipment is there) *sigh* That is all. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Rob Zamites Converse, Texas USA [1194.7, 227.1] Apparent Rennerian * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 01:40:35 -0400 From: "Ken Taborek" <Ken.Taborek at verizon.net> Subject: Re: 5 layered Black and Tan (ODB OAK BARREL STOUT) [rdavis77 said, snipped] > (by the way their OAK BARREL STOUT is now in bottles (as of March 25), I > think the only brewer in America to have worked out a bottled formula > for stout conditioned in bourbon barrels....really delicious) Those in > the mid-Atlantic region look for it in stores....(no I don't work for > Old Dominion!)) rdavis77, While I'm a great fan of ODB, and I am firmly of the opinion that their Oak Barrel Stout is one of the best beers in the world, I don't believe that the bottled version of their Oak Barrel Stout ever sees the inside of a bourbon barrel. I could be wrong, but I've spoken with the bartenders, brewers, and the general manager many times over the past year or so on the topic of their attempts to find a recipe that can be mass produced to a degree that will allow them to bottle Oak Barrel Stout (the 'original' Oak Barrel Stout is available only on draft in their brew pub, stop in and try it, you'll be bringing home a growler. And no, I don't work for ODB either). What I've gathered is that they have tried to capture the flavors that are imparted by the bourbon barrels, in a way that will allow for a larger volume of production than their current method of aging a finished beer for three weeks in barrels that were used for aging bourbon. Reading from the back label of their newly bottled Oak Barrel Stout, it would appear that they've found that the flavor of the barrel aging can be approximated by the use of vanilla beans and oak. I'll need to confirm that the next time I have a chat with the brewers or GM. I've recently purchased a six of the new Oak Barrel Stout, and I find it to be very good. I'm not a certified beer judge, but both myself and my fiancee find it to have less body than the draft version, and a slightly different taste. It's still a fine product, and if I weren't 30 minutes from the brewery I would buy more of the bottled version. Since I am so close, I'll keep filling my growlers with the original. :) - -- Cheers, Ken PS: How do you manage to keep your Erol's address? RCN is trying so very hard to eliminate them in favor of at rcn.com addresses... Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 09:41:42 +0200 From: Thomas Rohner <t.rohner at bluewin.ch> Subject: Visit to Munich Hi Guys has anyone been in Munich recently? Do you have some suggestions what places to visit. I'll be there the weekend after easter. Thanks Thomas Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 06:21:41 -0400 From: "William Erskine" <werskin at sympatico.ca> Subject: Curious Yeast Behaviour Hi All, I am curious about the behaviour of my most recent batch of beer which is currently on day 8 of a primary fermentation. It's an all grain pale ale OG 1.048. I pitched a White Labs WLP002 English Ale Yeast (pitchable tube). Currently, it is down to about a bubble every 45 secs or so. But there is something very unusual, little white pieces of something (crud) are being shot off the bottom of the carboy like rockets. They travel very quickly about half way up and then float back to the bottom. It's very weird to watch, and one lifts off about every 3 - 6 seconds. Can someone explain what this is, and is it safe to rack into the secondary? I am assuming it is and plan to do it tomorrow night, but I am curious about this phenomenon. Also, is there anywhere online that I can go to see what people's experience with a particular yeast is? For example, I am interested in this latest Yeast I've used. I was looking on the White Labs Website and it's description for the yeast seems off so far. It describes a very strong flocculation, and I am seeing the opposite. It doesn't seem to be flocculating well at all. And I am not referring to the little rocket ships. The sediment doesn't seem well formed or compacted at all. It is clearing, just not with the characteristics that I expect. I haven't tasted it yet. That'll be the important test. Has anyone used this strain before? How did you like it? I understand that it is perhaps the Fuller's ESB Strain? Should be good. Looking forward to it. All help is greatly appreciated. Cheers, William Erskine. London, Ontario. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 06:12:47 -0400 From: darrell.leavitt at plattsburgh.edu Subject: adding H20 to the kettle MarMark Beck <beckmk at whitman.edu> shares his recipe for a bitter ,...thankyou. Why not add a bit more malt ...then collect more runoff, rather than adding water to the kettle? ..Darrell Plattsburgh,NY 44 41 58 N Latitude 73 27 12 W Longitude [544.9 miles, 68.9]Apparent Rennerian BTW: I had the pleasure of meeting Chad Stevens last night at the Cumberland Head Brewery! He and his wife stopped by for a few samples,...real good people... Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 09:41:38 -0300 From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu> Subject: Quick Beers Jeff Renner said: > I like to serve low gravity real ales fresh. I've served them in as > little as > five days "grain to brain," although that was in an emergency. The quickest "grain to brain" turnaround I've heard of so far was 2.5 days for a Hefeweizen made by Daniel Chisholm in Fredericton, NB. As I bottle, this impressed me even more than it would a kegger. Even if fermentation is quick, I still need to wait for the beer to condition in bottle. And I usually don't get around to bottling for a number of days... I've tasted Daniel's beer a month he had brewed it and his was quite possibly the nicest example of hefeweizen I've had so far. Tasty yet subtle, easily drinkable yet complex. What are people's experiences with quick beers? Apart from low-gravity, large amounts of yeast, and relatively high fermentation temperatures, are there other factors involved? Cheers! AleX in Moncton, NB [1568.9km, 68] Apparent Rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 08:59:07 -0500 From: "River Bound Brewing" <RiverBound at charter.net> Subject: Where am I? The River Bound Brewery, which is in my garage here in St. Louis, is at precisely [424.8, 236.8] Apparent Rennerian Pat Reddy - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.651 / Virus Database: 417 - Release Date: 4/5/2004 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 10:28:31 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: Water salts: kettle vs. mashtun "Dave Draper" <david at draper.name> writes from Albeq, err, Alberq, ahh, hell, ABQ: >am I *really* out of the loop?!? Yeah, but we'll help you get back up to speed. ;-). >why would anyone want to add the salts to the kettle, when it seems >pretty obvious that the salts must be present along with the >compounds in the grain in order to have the desired effect? We're advocating adding the salts directly to the mash, not to the kettle, although as Spencer says, there might be times that would work. I never do it. Warning, serious scientific stuff follows that you might not understand if you aren't a geologist. Wait a second, Dave, you are a geologist, aren't you? Normally you do add salts, like gypsum (CaSO4) and CaCl2, to the strike water, but chalk, CaCO3, unlike those other two, is very insoluble in water. But, if you mix it into the mash, the acidity of dark grains dissolves it, which raises the pH of the mash. This is the purpose of using it - for brewing dark beers with low alkalinity water, which would ordinarily make the mash too acidic. >Given that styles evolved from the presence of these compounds in >the water before it was mixed with the grain during the mash, and >not added to the >wort once it was in the boiler, how would one expect to have the >desired effect on things from doing so? Of course, you are right, these dark styles (porter, stout, Munich Dunkles, Edinburgh Scotch ales) did evolve by brewers who empirically discovered over centuries of brewing that they could make better dark beer than pale with their water. *They* certainly weren't adding chalk to their mash. But, they did live in areas of limestone and alkaline water. They were brewing with water that had picked up CO2 from falling through the atmosphere as rain, then more CO2 from subterranean bacteria, producing carbonic acid. This weakly acidic water seeped through limestone/chalk (both are CaCO3) soils, which dissolved some CaCO3, producing bicarbonate ions HCO3-1, which makes the water alkaline. If you wanted to mimic water from these dark beer areas, you could suspend (not dissolve) CaCO3 in water and bubble CO2 through it until it dissolved, duplicating nature. Or you can make life simple and add it to the mash. But you knew all this already, you were just temporarily out of the loop. Did I just hear the sound of a hand slapping a forehead down in New Mexico? ;-) Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 10:40:00 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: Re: session beer recipe Mark Beck <beckmk at whitman.edu> writes from Walla Walla, Wash. (does anyone else remember Pogo's "Nora's Freezin' on the Trolley"?) >a key to serving a good bitter, in my opinion, is low carbonation >and serving at the right temp. Too carbonated and too cold >accentuates the bitterness, while masking the malt and hop character. Amen, Brother. Preach it! Another trick for the right temperature is to keep some heavy pub "dimple" mugs in the freezer and draw the warmish beer into them. Of course, you have to have a mug for each pint you are going to have as this only works once. >I know the gravity and alc % of my beer are slightly high for a true >session beer--it's more of a Special Bitter than an Ordinary Bitter. >Next time I brew this I'm going to lower the gravity and try and >keep the mash temp up (fluctuated between 148-152 degrees, and I'd >like it to stay at the higher end.) You can also keep the final gravity up a bit (and the alcohol down) by using a less attenuative yeast than Danstar Nottingham. The 80% attenuation you got is typical of this yeast http://consumer.lallemand.com/danstar-lalvin/nottingham.html. If you like dry yeast, try Danstar Windsor http://consumer.lallemand.com/danstar-lalvin/windsor.html. Thanks for the contribution to this thread. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 10:51:05 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: head retention Todd in Idaho, masquerading as "Janie Curry" <houndandcalico at hotmail.com> (is he the hound or the calico?), writes: >I clean my bottles with powdered dish washer detergent at 140 F and rinse >well...I've read that pdwd can be detrimental to head retention but I will >change this practice on my next batch. Try some of the brewing cleaners such as One-Step or PBW, or just bleach. Of course, be sure to rinse well if you use bleach. Make sure your glasses are well washed and rinsed. But this is not likely the problem if you are indeed rinsing well. >I also use Ferm-Cap Not supposed to be a problem, and even is supposed to help. >I brew ales and typically do a George Fix style 3 step mash schedule with >the first step at around 95-100F x 30min to degrade beta glucans avoiding a >stuck mash. I think even George stopped using the protein rest (122F). This can really do a number on head forming and mouth feel proteins with modern malts. Are you resting there? Or are you using his later 40/60/70C (104/140/158F) schedule and skipping the 50C/122F protein rest? If you are doing the 40/60/70C schedule, how are you getting from the first step to 140F? If you are heating and recirculating, you may be spending too much time in the proteolytic range and destroying proteins. If you are adding boiling water, that should be OK, but then you may be really overdiluting your mash by the time you add enough to get to 158F. I suggest eliminating any rest below ~144F. The old "acid rest" or hydrolysis rest of ~100F is just not necessary for modern malts (nor is the protein rest). It doesn't hurt, it's just a problem getting from there to the sacch. rest. Good luck. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 11:11:11 -0400 From: Himsbrew at aol.com Subject: HELP!! Hello all.. was hoping to enter my recently brewed Irish red ale in the national homebrew contest. Upon looking at the style guide lines I don't know what category(in any) would be appropriate! Help!! deadline looms! private responses welcome also! jim cuny himsbrew at aol.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 12:00:54 -0400 From: Lee Ellman <lee.ellman at cityofyonkers.com> Subject: Where I am at! Hi. While I don't post that often I do faithfully read the digest and truly appreciate the knowledge base and civility by all. I often come away from my read wishing that I could find the perfect party that would be as well modulated and interesting as the digest. That said, I am from Yonkers NY home of the long gone Yonkers Brewing Co., and their famous dry beer "YB Dry". Oh, and also of the current Saw Mill River Brewing micro and my very own pico Tudor Woods Brewing Co. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 12:09:39 -0400 From: "Spencer Graham" <Spencer.Graham at mail.wvu.edu> Subject: Cheap Refrigerator Temperature Controller I have been thinking about delving into lager beers and know that temperature control is a key issue. I am also a ham radio operator and have built many radio kits and other electronic devices over the years as part of that hobby. A company called Rainbow Kits (see link below) has several kits for measuring temperature and controlling temperature, and I would like someone to take a look at those kits to see if they think the one kit for temperature control would be useful for converting a refrigerator to a lagering environment. I saw several commercial units listed in a brewing magazine and they are about $60+ and thought this might be a nice and cheaper way for brewers to control their refrigerators. Less than $10 is a heck of a difference in price. (They also have a kit that converts a digital VOM into a very precise thermometer!) Thought I would pass it on HBD for consideration. http://www.rainbowkits.com Spence Morgantown, West By Gawd Virginia Spencer W. Graham, II MBA Media Specialist West Virginia University Extended Learning One Waterfront Place 1st Floor Room 1500-D P.O. Box 6877 Morgantown, West Virginia 26506 (304) 293-1305 Extension 3# Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving all pretty and preserved, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming---"WOW! What a ride!" -- Anonymous Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 13:36:18 -0500 From: Bev Blackwood II <bdb2 at bdb2.com> Subject: Call for Judges - AHA Southern Regional The AHA Southern Regional Judging will take place at Saint Arnold Brewery on April 24th & 25th 2004. Site coordinator is Bev Blackwood of Houston's Foam Rangers, the AHA Liaison for Houston. DO NOT SEND ENTRIES to the judging site! Entries should be sent to: AHA Southern Regional c/o DeFalco's Home Wine & Beer Supplies, 8715 Stella Link, Houston, TX 77025. Schedule of events: Saturday, April 24th 9:00 a.m. - Noon 1st Session 12:30 p.m. - 5:00 p.m. Mini Pub Crawl (Transportation provided) 5:30 p.m. - 10:00 p.m. 2nd Session Sunday, April 25th 10:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m. 3rd Session (Lunch provided) If you're coming from out of town, there are two hotels located close to Saint Arnold Brewery. La Quinta Inn Houston Brookhollow, 11002 Northwest Freeway (Hwy 290), Phone: (713) 688-2581 or Houston Northwest Motel 6, US Route 290 at 5555 West 34th Street, Phone: (713) 682-8588 Saint Arnold Brewing Company is Texas' oldest microbrewery and is located at 2522 Fairway Park Drive, Houston, Texas 77092 If you're coming from out of town, let me know and I'll see if we can arrange any "beds for brewers," but be prepared to get a room should that not work out. Thanks for your assistance! -BDB2 Houston Liaison American Homebrewers Association http://www.beertown.org/homebrewing/index.html Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 12:29:49 -0700 From: Mark Beck <beckmk at whitman.edu> Subject: dry yeast In his reply to my post on session beers Jeff Renner writes: >You can also keep the final gravity up a bit (and the alcohol down) by >using a less attenuative yeast than Danstar Nottingham. The 80% >attenuation you got is typical of this yeast >http://consumer.lallemand.com/danstar-lalvin/nottingham.html. If you like >dry yeast, try Danstar Windsor >http://consumer.lallemand.com/danstar-lalvin/windsor.html. > Thanks for the tip Jeff. I'll look for the Windsor, but I'm not sure if my homebrew supplier carries it. One other yeast that I know I can get (and haven't tried yet, but intend to) is Safale S-04. Does anyone know what the apparent attenuation of this yeast is? I looked on the Crosby & Baker and DCL websites and the attenuation isn't listed. Crosby & Baker gives an email address, so I guess I'll email them and report back what I learn. Mark Beck Walla Walla, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 14:36:27 -0500 From: Bev Blackwood II <bdb2 at bdb2.com> Subject: Where in the world? > Jeff Renner requesteth: > It's time for my semi-annual request that posters tell us their name > and location. Bev Blackwood - Homebrewer, Competition Coordinator & Was-was-was-Waz of the Foam Rangers, KGB Double agent, Single malt scotch collector, Contributing editor, Southwest Brewing News, beer writer, AHA Houston area Liaison and proud promoter of the world's largest single site homebrew competition, The Dixie Cup! [1050.8, 217.5] Apparent Rennerian, otherwise known as Houston, Texas. -BDB2 Bev D. Blackwood II Co-Competition Coordinator The Foam Rangers http://www.foamrangers.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 13:08:54 -0700 From: "Dan Hansen" <dan at hansen.org> Subject: Dry hopping problem I made the mistake of adding hop pellets to my secondary thinking that they would settle out. WRONG! Most of the hops settled out, but the hops that are left plug the poppet valve in the keg, completely closing off any flow. Believe me, I won't make that mistake again. Now, to problem at hand, how do I save my batch of beer? I see Zymico has a product called a hopperstopper that is a screen that is placed on the end of the dip tube, but it's not for commercial resale. Does anyone know of a commercial product available to screen out the hops, or is there a work around that someone could suggest? Thanks Dan Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 16:14:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Tom M" <tomomeier at excite.com> Subject: re: session beer recipe Mark Beck wrote: >Since he liked his brew so much, I'd ask Tom to post his >recipe. I looked at many recipes in Wheeler and Protz's great books. There is nothing consistent between the various interpretations, so I settled on just using some crystal, but with no adjuncts so I would not have to mini-mash. Extremely simple recipe. Recipe for 11 gallons: Base Grains mashed at ~151-152F* (?) 98% Marris-Otter* 2% Carahelles (10L crystal)* Steeping grains - 14 oz of 40L crystal *The base wort was mashed on Yazoo Brewing's commercial system as part of a Nashville HB event. This is the main reason it turned out so tasty. Many thanks to our gracious hosts Linus and Lila Hall. Your kindness is second only to the quality of your beers! Post Boil OG - 1.042 Bittering hops - EKG to 20 IBU Flavor hops - 1oz of EKG at 10min before kko Yeast - I used a 4oz glob of Yazoo's house yeast, a british ale yeast. Closest match to my taste would be WL-002. Fermented at 60F external to the fermentor for 11 days, racked to 5.5 gallon vertical pin, 1/2 cup of table sugar, stored at room temp for 4 days, then moved to 60F, chilled to 48F before driving in soft spile, 24 hours later tapped and served at 52F. - -- I noticed the thread about Oak Barrel Stouts. Some fellow HB'ers and I brewed a barrel of Imperial Stout that has been aging in a JD barrel. It started to pick up vanilla from the oak at about 5 months. As a commercial venture, this would tie-up a large amount of space, not to mention take forever to age. Anyone who produces it should be commended for their patience and willingness to forgo profits and conven- ience in pursuit of a higher purpose. An easier way to produce it may be to steep bourbon barrel char in the secondary. As rdavis77 mentioned, vanilla is also a necessary component. There was an address and phone # for bourbon char in the May 2003 BYO article on barrel aging. It is basically the scrapings from inside the charred barrel - which is what gives american whiskey and bourbon most of its flavor. Tom Meier Nashville, TN Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 18:48:11 -0400 From: "Greg Hunter" <ghunter at adelphia.net> Subject: pumps I am interested in getting a pump for moving wort. I can't afford a peristaltic pump and have seen numerous mag drive pumps on ebay. Is there any particular type of mag drive pump I should look for? I have seen some garden/pool type pumps and was wondering if these were ok for pumping hot wort? Gregory F. Hunter P.O. Box 291-A Duxbury, MA 02331 ghunter at adelphia.net 654.3 86.2 rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 19:58:31 -0400 From: "-S" <-s at adelphia.net> Subject: beer & health (again) Here is another article on the benefits of moderate drinking: http://snipurl.com/5j9z Gotta take my vitmains & minerals ! later, -S Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 20:32:04 -0400 From: David Perez <perez at gator.net> Subject: Barrel Aged Speaking of barrel aged ale, has anyone tried the Old Engine Oil Special Reserve? It is aged six months in "Malt Whisky Casks". I picked up a few bottles to give it a try but don't know much about it's quality other than it is supposedly a bit tannic. I was thinking about opening one at our next club meeting and then aging the others for another 6 months to a year, to see if they smooth out. Dave Perez Hogtown Brewers Gainesville, FL Return to table of contents
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